I am currently waiting for a Deeper State from the good ol’ BST and this fine community. I plan to do the same mod to it as I do for my Deep State. I know that everyone has their own preferences, and setups can vary greatly depending on style and preference of the player. So in no way am I saying this is the best or only way for a setup to be. Now what I’m after here is responsive play. I’ve tried lubing bearings for improved response and it does work. It actually amazes me how sensitive a Yoyo can be made with lubricants. But any amount of lubricant that you apply to the bearing…slows it down… take a second to absorb that. If the lubricant slows the bearing, it also slows the physics of the Yoyo. It also robs power as a result of the more rapid deceleration of the Yoyos spin as a result of having the lube in the bearing. Now here is where I admit that I understand there are certain styles that depend on this type of play. It’s just not what I’m after. I much rather prefer to modify the setup in a way similar to the old Raider mods. Bring those halve closer together a little at a time until the response system is giving you the response you want with a dry bearing; which we all know will have the greatest possible spin time and speed. It’s my preference to have the greatest spin possible because the faster the spin, the greater the centrifugal force, and I prefer the way that feels. Just more powerful and stable to me. So this thread will unfold as I receive my Deeper State YoYo, and document my modifications as I go. So if this interests you, stay tuned for more. And hit that like so I know you care.
Edit: I spent a large portion at the start of this thread fabricating my own shims. This worked but took a lot of time and it was very difficult to keep the shims level while reducing their thickness. At post 57 there is a link to the perfect stainless steel shims. There is still much great info between the beginning and post 57 but I would recommend most people steer away from fabricating shims.
Since I play mostly 2A which deals with responsiveness a lot, I have a few suggestions.
Yes lube in the bearing will always act as a “brake”. The thicker the lube, the more responsive it’ll become, but the quicker it slows down.
It is actually possible to tune the responsiveness by mixing two different lube thickness on the same bearing.
However, lube can wear out. With 2A I have to re-lube every 5 strings or so, and each string wears out around an hour, so around 5 hours of play. But 2A isn’t nearly as aggressive as 0A on the lube since the yoyo mostly loops instead of sleeps.
My suggestion is to make a compromise, either use thinner combination (more thin lube than thick lube) to get slightly more spin time, but you have to re-apply often, or use thicker lube and live with less spin time, but you don’t have to relube too often.
Also, the way you move the yoyo and how the string rubs the wall makes huge difference in terms of spin time. The tidier and straighter your tricks are, the longer it will spin.
There are many ways to arrive at a similar place. The goal of this thread is to document my method of reaching the result that I prefer. It will appeal to some, but not to all, as this mod will require some material to be removed from the Side Effects and axle. As well as some fine tuning, but it is a method that is accessible to anyone that would like to try it. It is reversible with no work at all and even though the side effects receive some trimming, a full size bearing can go back in and there is no negative effect from the trimmed parts. Also Side Effects are replaceable. So if there was a spare set laying around you could try this on them, if you were so inclined. I just don’t want to give the impression that everyone needs to go out and do this, but it will interest some. I appreciate your input as it brings life to alternate methods. I hear tell of a time when you could buy premade shims and that would take a great deal of work out of this method, but since I’ve not found any online, I’ll be fabricating shims from brass washers. This won’t be a mod for the faint of heart, or those who get shy around tools.
So here comes what is bound to be the first of at least a few retractions. I just remembered that the Deeper State does not have Side Effects on it. Which is going to change slightly, the method needed to achieve the final goal. However, even if upon receiving the deeper state, I find out that it cannot be modded in this way, I do have another Deep State that I am wanting to MOD so I will make the Thread about that. Here are pics of my “already” modified Deep State. The axle was trimmed with Dremel making sure to bevel the edges for smooth assembly. The axle is held in place by Loctite or some similar type adhesive and that is why I chose to trim the axle. I was concerned about marring the Side Effect if I tried to remove the axle, and it didn’t need much trimmed so I figured going with the next size down would be removing too much axle. Since I left the axle in I had to trim the non-axle Side Effect on the bearing seat in order to allow them to screw together a tad closer. Also I’ve made shims out of hardware store brass washers. All of the details, tools, and method for the Deep State will be applied to another Deep State I’m modding and I’ll follow the process here. Also going to see how this applies to the Deeper State as well. That’s all for today. Thanks for tuning in!!
I actually have a few other throws that my favorite setup for them is one little touch of black moly grease covered with a drop of thin lube and a few good throws to spread it out. I also couldn’t agree more with your statement about string play and accuracy. I’m still only recently coming back to Yoyo so I decided to stick with the narrow profiles to help in that regard and I can say that , while the slim lines stay frustrating, when I grab a Yoyo with a wider gap I’m rewarded with much improvement. Of course helpful people willing to share their tips, like yourself, help many to enjoy this fine addiction.
It depends on the thickness of the shims. I’m custom fitting mine. Trim a little, give it try, wash rinse repeat until you get the response you want. I’m trying to attain all of the response coming from the pads so when I got to the point where I needed to trim that bearing seat, it was for achieving what I was personally looking for. But with a blank in there like you have, that should allow for more responsiveness with a larger gap. I’m going for a dry bearing that is spinning like a banshee. Im looking for nice snappy response from a yo-yo that’s spinning like mad. So I had to squeeze mine together a bit tighter than the posts would allow to get what I wanted from the pads. This will come down to personal preference for anyone who tries this. If you can get the performance that you love without having to shave the seat, then that’s awesome. Less work for you.
This is my previously modified Deep State (red) next to my unmodified blue one. The difference isn’t much, but with a dry, half-bearing in there, as opposed to a dry full sized bearing, that little bit is the difference between being fully unresponsive and just waiting for your command. And with no bearing deceleration from lubricants.
So the tools I use are pretty simple. A Dremel with a cutting wheel, a pair of needle nosed pliers, and file. That’s pretty much it. Preferably the pliers would have a coated handle. If not, you may want a second pair of pliers of some sort with the coated handle.
For the shims, I went to the local hardware store and looked through their binned hardware for brass or copper washers. I found a brass one that fit the bill. You’ll want to find one that fits nicely on the bearing post. Some slack is fine. I just took my Side Effects to the store and used them as a guide. You’ll of course need a half bearing as well.
Some who wish to do this may be fortunate enough to already have shims , as they were available…and now they’re not. So one of you has some…I know it.
Or maybe you’re fortunate enough to be able to 3D print some. This would also be suitable. I did not have any of these. So I resort to rudimentary methods to fabricate my own. Now that I think of it, you may be able to find nylon washers to fit the bill and they’d be a tad easier to work with I imagine. However, I chose brass. The goal will be to use the Dremel to remove excess circumference from the washers. Then file them down to the desired thickness. (That part is trial and error). The shim needs to engage the inner ring of the bearing without interfering with the motion of the outer ring. Some bearings have thicker rings than others so keep that in mind and check your bearing.
I use the cutting wheel on the Dremel and the players to hold the washer. I then cut from the outer edge toward the center all the around the washer. I then continue trimming with the cutting wheel until the material is sufficiently removed to allow the bearing to sit on top of it (on the post) and spin freely with no interference. No…they don’t look pretty, but no guts look pretty, and these are guts. Next we’ll trim the thickness.
In order to trim the thickness, I use the handle of the pliers like finger, to run the washer on the file and trim it down. Here’s where that coated handle comes in. It grips the washer very nicely and makes the job easier. I usually do 5 or so strokes back and forth, turn 90 degrees and do the same until I’ve went all the way around (4 turns). I then flip it over and do the other side. After this initial flip there’s no further need to flip again, this was just to get rid of all the burrs from the Dremel. I do this to both washer, assemble then test the yo-yo, repeating until you get the response you like
. It’s best to do a little at a time like this and test to keep from going too far. You can trim these shims a fair amount before getting to the point where the post needs trimmed. If at anytime during this process, you test your yo-yo and you are happy with its play…you are done. If not…keep trimming. Watch those fingers. At this point it would be a good reminder that…tools can hurt you…please be responsible for your own safety. If you get to the point where the posts collide and you can go no further, but you’d still like a bit more response, it’ll then be necessary to trim the post on the non-axle Side Effect. Also, you may or may not have made it this far without needing to trim the axle as well. You’ll know you need to trim the axle or posts when you put it together and it gets to a point where it won’t tighten. This is because the axle has hit bottom or the posts have collided. It will almost feel like you’ve stripped it out but it’s only because it’s not allowing the halves to close enough to engage the shims but the screw can go no further so the halves then feel floppy. Next up, trim the axle/ bearing post.
Get a Bolt that fits the inner diameter of the brass washer. Use a nut to pinch the washer against the head of the bolt.
Put bolt into a cord/cordless drill. Then spin the washer on your file. Poor mans lathe if you will. Would keep your shims more true and safer than your dremel method. Also works in a drill press for those that have one.
Note: you can do both washers at the same time with this method and end up with both being the same.
Thank you for the added suggestions. I got in a hurry tonight and tried to take too much off the thickness at once and ended op making them un-level. This of course makes the halves sit crooked. Start again tomorrow with a new set of washers.
Makes me wish I’d pulled the trigger on those Dif e Yo spacers before they were all gone.
Since you mentioned this, and I need to make a new set of shims (learn from my mistakes people) I’ll just try your idea out. I have a lot of running to do today so it will not happen for a minute but I’ll get pics.
Sand paper can be used also. For those without the file.
Another idea for width reduction; place a fine grit sand paper on a flat surface. Use a sanding block with coarser grit sand paper (Cheap rubber sand block works).
Place sanding block on top of washer and slow circles. This should aid in not taking too much off of one side.
The finer the sand paper, the less material comes off per stroke. And fine = more polished look.
I also couldn’t agree more with your statement about string play and accuracy. I’m still only recently coming back to Yoyo so I decided to stick with the narrow profiles to help in that regard and I can say that , while the slim lines stay frustrating, when I grab a Yoyo with a wider gap I’m rewarded with much improvement. Of course helpful people willing to share their tips, like yourself, help many to enjoy this fine addiction.
Next we’ll trim the thickness.
