Well yeah I’m not requiring that it be organic, just that it cut in strongly from the response well to the cup to be considered a true H. You could make a very angular H if you wanted to!
I’d agree all of those, but the Vector, is a H. Vector is more W, it looks a lot like the Arctic Circle 2.
Aka H/V or H/W hybrid 
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Very angular H, like the WAngle Shutter?
I don’t agree, none of these are H to me because they don’t cut in strongly from the response well to the cup.
- YYO Vector
- Mowl M
- YYF Genesis
- ThrowRevolution Kaiser
- YYO Apex
Of the “strong H” search results
- iYoYo Firrox
- SoSerious Chronos
- YYF Regen
This is better, but Chronos, not really, it doesn’t cut in strongly enough from the response well.
It’s interesting to me how you can kinda mathematically define O, V, and W… but H is much more open to interpretation.
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H has pretty much always meant a defined step, and they’ve always been from the rim. Why the Chronos would qualify. Why the Regen is a H. Why the og Dang is an H, and so forth.
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I feel that the 2016 Benchmark H is different enough from the W to be considered more than just a “tweaked W”. Looks close enough to the spirit of H shapes to qualify as one in my view, even if it isn’t an “extreme” or “strong” H. It’s still in the H “family”, AFAIC.
Having said that, there is one point that @codinghorror makes that I kinda agree with, and that is that if yoyos with two different shapes don’t play differently, then what’s the point of giving them different shapes? Aesthetics alone aren’t enough to justify new shapes, IMO. If I’m not mistaken, new body shapes have historically appeared in an attempt to either push the performance envelope or to provide a distinct play experience. In that sense, if the Benchmark W and H don’t feel any different in play, then something has gone wrong, since that kind of redundancy indicates a failure of (shape) design, in my view. If all other specs are equal (and they are on the Benchmarks) then the one thing that differentiates them–their shapes–should yield a difference in play experience, otherwise the Benchmark experiment kinda fails.
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It could just be that some players don’t feel the difference.
Just like some people would drive a Ferrari and then drive a Honda and say “I don’t see any difference.” Or a guitar player playing a $100 starter guitar and then playing a $3500 guitar and saying there isn’t a difference. It’s not that there isn’t a difference, it’s just that some people aren’t at a level that they can feel a difference.
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I wouldn’t describe it that way. I’d describe it this way
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The play difference between benchmarks O, V and W is large, and obvious.
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The play difference between benchmark H and W is small, and subtle.
However, if it was a iYoYo style H… then it would be more along the lines of the other benchmarks, more consistent with their relationship with each other… a large diffence in feel and play.
It is fair to say I’m also biased because the strong iYoYo H is fun as heck to play 
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Agreed.
I can’t speak directly on the matter since I don’t have a 2016 Benchmark W to compare to my H. 
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You’ll find one
Not disagreeing there. What I’d call (and I think most people do to) a bell shape is an extremely good shape.
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Yes, and the problem with that is that differences which are really small and subtle may fall below the threshold of one’s ability to determine if the shape is the element responsible for the perceived differences in play (as opposed to other factors like string condition, bearings condition, differences due to machining tolerances, etc.).
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I don’t disagree but the issue I have there is that the “H” is being called based on rim angles?
On the right “bell”, but on the left, “H” … solely because the rim angles are straight vs. smoothed?
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Yes. It’s not just a straight vs. smooth. They’re two totally different shapes and styles.
Take the Regen and Chronos for example. They both have a distinct step at the rim, that’s what distinguishes the H shape. From there, one is rounded, the other V shape. But they both have the distinctive step from the rim that H shapes have.
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I disagree, and I think this is where the iYoYo definition of H is more accurate.
The steepness of the angle from the response well is what primarily determines an H
what doesn’t determine an H is whether the rim is angled versus smoothed.
So in my above chopped up pic, both of these are H, because the angle from the response well is steep enough to make it an H. The rim could be angled, smoothed, bumpy, serrated, doesn’t matter.
Now if you wanna say “organic H” sure go for it. Lots of hybrids, the Shutter is such an amazing hybrid of all the shapes, which is why I think it works so well!
(and I support “bell shape” as shorthand for “organic H”)
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Did you completely forget about Onedrops very 1st H-shape yoyo… THE CODE 1!?
intense prairie dog stare inserted here
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It’s in the ballpark. Angle is a bit … high.
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He’s got an idea of what an H shape is based on iYoYo’s description of what an H shape is.
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Whooooaaaaaa… There’s another one to talk about.
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