Why do you think so few 'Pros' frequent the forums?

General Yo-Yo
1

So here’s the thing:

These forums are one of the biggest and most active yoyo forums that there is. However, there seem to be very few famous/sponsored players that are willing to come on here and discuss all things yoyo.

  • Paul Dang graces us with his presence the most frequently. Paul, please don’t ever leave us. ;D

  • Erik Koloski and Palli have also been known to drop in from time to time. Haven’t seen Palli around in a while though.

However, we know that there are tonnes of really talented players out there, so why do you think so few players wish to be part of the online forum community?

Now I know there are a few simple/witty answers to this question that someone will come in and post to a swarm of likes, so I’m getting in there first:

  1. “They’re too busy actually yoyoing.”
  2. “They don’t want to come on here and discuss mundane topics.”
  3. “They actually have lives.”

Yes yes, very amusing. :-X

In regards to point #2: I think as with a lot of things in life, you get out what you put in. The reason why these forums can at times get a tad stale is because we have so few people willing to come on and help make things more exciting.

If we had this lot on here:

https://www.worldyoyocontest.com/2014worlds/wp-content/uploads/2014/08/IMG_1427.jpg(image larger than 4 MB)

Then I’m pretty sure things would be a lot more interesting. I’m aware there are those that don’t have English as a native language, so I’m mostly referring to the American scene here.

I can’t help but wonder. The reason why these guys/gals are the best at what they do is because they put in so much time and effort to the hobby. Many of them no doubt dedicate hours each day to hardcore practice.

Now surely the main reason why anyone would put in so much practice has to be because they simply love yoyoing. Such passion for getting good must surely stem from a love of all things return top…?

Now if you love something that much, why wouldn’t you want to talk about it? ???

Apart from a few choice (and much appreciated) individuals, it’s like the sponsored yoyo players at large seem to completely avoid this place.

Why do you think that is? Could anything be done to change it? What can we do to stop Paul from leaving?

Discuss.

(ps. I had far too little sleep this weekend so I’m practically braindead, I apologise if any of this reads a little incoherently.)

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Hi,

maybe it’s easier to answer by asking the question slightly differently: why should they join the YYE forum, what’s their benefit?

We benefit from their input, their experience, their know-how. But what would they get?

Cheers
Andreas

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it reads fine Gambit… i have noticed this also and the only thing i can come up with is that this forum has given itself a bad rep sometimes… especially with some of the people we have had on who seem to exist just to cause issues…

i talked to one of my friends Noel Kunz and he said that most of the big names moved away from forums when yoyonation went down. They moved on with their life and moved away from forums. Now that we have facebook its even harder because its available to more people and is also more easily recognized then the older outdated forum.

Anther thing is people on the forum has been stigmatized as being young dumb… they are all the people who dont like facebook or reddit or are too young to have facebook. We haven’t really done much to turn those false things aside. its true we do have kids on the forum and that we are family friendly, but its a much better alternative as to what happens on the facebook forums sometimes.

I think that if someone really approached them at a contest and plead the case of the forums we might get a few in… but thats still a low chance that they do.

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They would get to rep their sponsor in an active community. I thought that was the point of being a sponsored player.

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Good question Andres, thanks for getting the discussion going. :slight_smile:

In answer I would say - the same thing we do. The enjoyment of discussing our views on the hobby we all love, and the knowledge of knowing that we can help others by doing so. It’s an interchange of experience and input on here, not merely a Q and A with the more experienced members.

People like Ed, Kyo, Mo and Steve (who is possibly one of the busiest men alive, yet still finds the time to post here) come on here to share their years of experience and seem to be happy to do so. One could reason that they get nothing out of it either, yet they still support the forums nonetheless… perhaps aware of the fact that being able to pass on their knowledge to others and help the community thrive is it’s own reward. :slight_smile:

What is the difference between active forum members on here and the ‘pros’ besides skill level? If there are so many of us on here who are happy to come on here every day (at least 300 members a day), why should that change when someone gets sponsored or starts competing?

Also, this is a fair point.

6

Glad to hear I’m not slurring my words too much. :stuck_out_tongue:

Yes, as with anywhere on the internet, there can be disagreements and contentions here and there, but for the most part this place is pretty friendly. Most out-of-line posts are quickly pounced on by the mods, so things don’t usually get too out of hand.

Still, I can understand that if people see this place as being unfriendly, it’d definitely be a major offputting factor.

This is a fair point. I think it’s all a matter of perspective though, a lot of people seem to take new people in a negative light:

Person 1 - “that place is full of noobs and kids.”

Person 2 - “that place is full of people that are just starting out and need help/advice.”

There’s nothing wrong with people being new, and if anything I would have thought that since a lot of new throwers find their way onto these forums, then companies and sponsored players would be treating this place like their ‘front line’ to try and sell these new guys their yoyos.

As it stands, it’s down to Sparhawk and Gregp to give them great recommendations for what throws to get in the “looking for help/recommendation” thread. If I was a manufacturer I’d be prowling that board like a hungry lion selling my product to anyone that’d listen… :stuck_out_tongue:

Thanks for the input Alecto. The facebook forum thing is a whole 'nother kettle of fish, I’m going to see where the rest of this topic goes before I delve into it right away so please don’t feel that I’m ignoring the point.

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I think this isn’t necessarily the best place for sponsors to just have their sponsored players advertise. They can really do one of two things: 1) have their sponsored players come on here to recommend their best throws and/or 2) they can just make awesome product and 10 times the amount of people will advertise for them, without the cost of giving them all throws, string, or bearings for being part of the team. From a business perspective, sponsored players can make the company more money and reach a wider audience from putting in effort to win contests or put out insane videos.

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to back up my facebook point what does a person these days think of when he thinks of an online site where you can interact with friends… facebook or forum… most likely facebook.

thats another reason we are losing people.

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But they can do it via Facebook, YouTube, Instagram, etc and possibly even much better then coming here. If that is the main reason be active on this forum, then there is no real incentive for them. It’s just an option since representation can be done in other ways as well.

The “General Yoyo Forum” is by far the most active one here. Often times the topics revolve around generic “small talk” things: How did you get started? What’s your favorite yoyo? How many yoyos do you own? What are your main wants? Who’s your favorite player?

The longer you’re active in a community, the better you’re able to cherry pick your means of interaction. After a while you’ve seen it all and you concentrate on things that give you the return that you think is best for you. And in the case of this forum it seems that the more advanced players become less active here and instead concentrate on other ways to interact with the community.

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Well, I think there are several reasons why they might not frequent the forums. I’m not saying any of them are true, or particularly good reasons, but that’s up for debate. Something tells me, that for each player who does not post on the forum, the answer is different. We may never know. I made up some possible reasons though…

  1. They reach people in other ways, schools, clubs, contests.
  2. They prefer to offer help to people in person.
  3. They prefer other “social media or online networks” like Facebook, Instagram, Twitter.
  4. They think forums are for beginners, and rarely find topics interesting for advanced players.
  5. They might be offended to see threads containing negative subject matter about themselves, their signature yo-yos, or the companies they represent.
  6. The yo-yo fame has gone to their heads. :smiley:
  7. They had a negative forum experience.
  8. They can yo-yo well, but they aren’t particularly social.
  9. They don’t like the internet at all.
  10. They think the forum will take time away from yo-yoing.
  11. They don’t want to discuss yo-yos and be tempted to buy any more of them. They like “free” throws. :smiley:
  12. They actually read the forums all the time, they just never post. Not everyone who reads the forums post to let us know they’ve been on here (I found John Chow this way years ago).
  13. They would rather not reveal too much personality, and remain a neutral figure to represent the brand. They fear a comment can be taken out of context and reflect poorly on the brand.
  14. They think a bunch of little kids will swarm them with PMs, and then call them rude if they don’t get a reply.
  15. They think the thread topics just repeat themselves over and over again. Seen one, seen them all. Boring! ::slight_smile:

The list goes on. For each player, the answer would be different, and I’m not sure what the most common theme would be. But I’m just happy we have several who are willing to post every now and then. Whether they post to promote things, offer opinion or advice, knowledge of yo-yo history, or whatever. I wouldn’t want people to be some place they would rather not be. So, I never feel like anything is missing from the forum. And, my favorite player will always post here. ;D

1 Like
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@TA #10 definitely

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If I had to bet, I’d bet that’s the most common theme on the list too. :wink:

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Another aspect I would add is that a lot of forum conversation is focused on equipment when top players tend to be focused more on tricks.

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pretty much all of the big-name players came up posting on the message boards, whether it was yoyoing.com, theyo, dave’s, extremespin, yoyonation, etc. so many pros started out reading and posting at those sites, and i’m sure that will continue to be the case for yoyoexpert.

once you’ve reached a certain level though, your yo-yoing is just kind of “your yo-yoing”. your attitude towards it might be influenced by the friends you’ve made and keep up with online or at contests, but not really by what happens on a message board. also, it’s hard to read the same topics coming up again and again. you can only have the same conversations with people you don’t know so many times before it becomes a grind. and like nathan said, active pros tend to be interested in yo-yoing as opposed to the “stuff” (or, i would add, the drama attached to the stuff), which makes up a lot of message board content.

really, any message board boils down to a place for establishing connections with people and building friendships, OR (for some) a scrap to achieve some sort of reputation or notoriety. but if you’ve established a reputation, have developed relationships, and you’re secure in your play, they can be downright exhausting.

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Having bounced around on social media a bit, it seems to me that a large part of the answer lies therein. Instagram is a great platform for sharing short trick videos without having to make a production out of it, and it ties into Facebook. Facebook also allows easy sharing of videos, but is more useful as a platform for discussion. A bunch of pros are on Facebook and contribute regularly.

I still love the forums, but social media fills some gaps left by forums. Forums do one thing significantly better than social media, though: they form a “catalog” of yoyo-related conversations. And ongoing conversations tend to be more persistent. Whereas a forum can sustain a “what are you throwing today?” thread, a new one comes up on Facebook whenever a user identifies that there’s not one currently being bumped.

All in all… since people want things fast and immediate, I think more are just using Facebook. And that’s enough “conversation” to occupy their time that they’re not spreading it as much onto forums. Me (not a pro), I see the value of both, so I use both.

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I really have to agree with the point that this forum is kid-oriented. I’m not saying it’s a bad thing, but it’s a fact. Naturally, kids are beginners and really don’t have the means to significantly add to advanced “conversation”.

Gentry was very active on Yoyonation before he became world champ. It makes sense there was more “conversation” on Yoyonation, they had around 45,000 members if I remember correctly. There were more people.

People also discussed more about what could be done with yoyos. There were pages and pages regarding Luke’s paint jobs or Modfather’s mods. There were a slew of painters and anodizers. Vendetta, Jason, and Brett to mention a few. People were less focused on what was wrong with a yoyo. For instance we all complain about vibe, and how a throw isn’t stable, etc. They figured out how to improve yoyos.

We need more of those people. I agree that we need more open ended discussion, and not one-dimensional talk like what’s your favorite throw.

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Yes they should be here more active.

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What Nathan and Ed said pretty much sums it up… but I’ll add my comments anyway :slight_smile:

Those of us who have been doing this a very long time…

  1. we don’t care what yoyo is new, or what the latest bearing is, or what new splash color is the current fad… sorry, we just don’t. As Nathan said topics on boards tend to be equipment focused… at some point in your yoyoing you move beyond that.

  2. we’re happy to help you and make recommendations… but honestly, doing it every day for (in my case) 17 years gets a little difficult. Ask in person and you’ll always get an answer though… it’s just hard to find energy to seek out those questions.

  3. FB and other social media makes it easier for us to chat with those with whom we’ve built relationships with over the last many years… it eliminates the (for lack of a better term) “noise” of a board and lets us focus on conversations with those we know.

  4. because we’ve been doing this a long time, we’re obviously older… many are married and have full time jobs, some have families… this makes our time very limited, so we are less likely to spend it on a message board.

It’s not that the pros don’t care, or think ‘oh it’s just a bunch of kids’… it’s just hard to make it a priority.

I stick around and lurk in certain sections of the board, mostly modding as it’s always been one of my main interests… it’s partly out of a desire to share information and make sure new players have access to a knowledge base that will steer them in the right direction… and partly out of pure habit, I’ve just done it for a very long time.

Kyle

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Did you read the thread about Ann?

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I know what you’re getting at, Ben, and I agree. Who would want to hang out somewhere they’re made to feel badly?

But at the same time, the OP of that thread claims to be a fan, and the vast majority of the comments in that thread were telling any “haters” that they’re out of line, while at the same time making a big list of the awesome things she’s done.

If she was a forum regular, the thread probably wouldn’t have went the same way… people are a bit on the cowardly side overall and wouldn’t likely insult her knowing that she might read it. Not at ALL saying she or anybody else needs to maintain a “preventative presence” or anything like that, but if the conversation is about how the forums would be different, I think it fits in.

But more importantly: if I were Ann and I read that thread, I would walk away pretty much happy that 95% of the comments were positive and the 5% that weren’t were shot down in a flaming heap of poop. As far as I could tell, any attempts to bring her down were hugely unsuccessful, which is a FURTHER testament to how good she is for yoyo. :wink:

1 Like