I don’t like where this discussion is heading. Please refrain from talking smack about eachother. This discussion is about tri metals in general and more accurately the idea I had and the small changes to it I had.
To summarize the updated idea. (You can find the logic for these changes and the idea itself in the posts before this.)
Looks like a bimetal, has tungsten inside it. The tungsten would be shredded,crushed, whatever into dust. That dust would be inside the steel. The steel would be like a modern day car tire, compartmentalized. In the case of tires it is full of air, but in this case it’s tungsten dust. The design would allow faster acceleration of the tungsten, would negate the brittleness of tungsten and wouldn’t look too weird.
This discussion isn’t specifically about the hideyoshi but it is a tri metal. Just please be polite.
CLEARLY POINT of its a gut feeling or a mathematically provable fact. Ex) that’s beautiful. Or Tungsten is about 2.5 times denser than steel.
Posts being very impolite will be reported from now on. Continue with the discussion.
Does the tungsten dust move around inside the steel compartment, or is it solid like a boiled egg? because I can’t quite understand why would the design allow “faster acceleration” of the tungsten? what confuses me is if the tungsten is not inside the steel compartment, will it accelerate… less?
Na it WOULD accelerate faster on the outside. It would just break REALLY easily. Tungsten is stupidly brittle. That’s why it should be dust. And the steel has to be compartmentalized so the tungsten dust isn’t just hanging around while the inner part is spinning. The steel would push it directly instead of just relying on the friction between the dust and the steel.
You know what a car tire looks like on the inside? Replace the rubber with steel and replace the air with tungsten dust. That’s what it should be.
Hopes this helps.
Now that I think about it, if done improperly, this would be stupidly heavy.
Your tungsten dust isn’t going to be nearly as dense as the solid material
This yoyo would be a production nightmare, haha. One can only imagine how much money, time and b-grades/protos a company would have to go through before they could fashion a usable product… let alone one that didn’t vibrate like a Dubstep drop. It’d have to cost like $10,000 just to make up the machining/labour costs. 
It’s an interesting idea for sure, but surely using Tungsten Carbide weight rings would achieve the same thing for a lot less work?
That’s your opinion. There’s a good chance Kyo is -the- most knowledgeable person on this forum when it comes to the mathematics and physics behind yoyos (DB is up there). His yoyos from years back were based off of the golden ratio, and have you ever seen the birds nest?
The fact that Doc rescinded his claim based on Kyo’s is significant, have you ever seen him back down elsewhere?
Never questioned what he knows just stating facts he said the throws vibed but yet they don’t vibe at all
He also said he assumed that was fixed, giving him benefit of the doubt.
He said the prototypes vibed I own the prototypes that he is talking about
It’s all opinion based, vibe that is. When you own a Nostalgia, I’m sure everything vibes.
you mean by direct sintering? I think a better choice is to just use platinum.
Realistically, even platinum is barely 3 times heavier than steel, so assuming fixed ring od and width, its id will only be ~1.1x less. To make a single steel ring at 29g, 56mm od and 6mm width, it needs to be 1.5mm thick with some theoretical 19g material, while still only 4mm thick with regular steel. The center of mass would only be shifted by 1.25mm.
In general, the problem isn’t about the rims themselves being not heavy enough, but accually reducing dead weight from places you don’t want them, which really just means finding specifically stronger materials that can be machined thin.
The thing is, they did… and Julio -himself- told me that even before I threw it. He said it was a problem they were working on… heck he even posted about it before worlds when he talked about the alumigo yo-yos.
I’m not sure what’s up for debate there… if you have prototypes that don’t vibe, either they were changed or tuned in some way, or they are different yo-yos.
Back to the actual topic… this idea makes absolutely no sense to me. Putting tungsten inside steel just makes a heavy rim. Once again, what material is used is irrelevant, only the mass matters. More mass on the rim also means acceleration is SLOWER, NOT faster.
If you want tungsten rims, just use a copper tungsten alloy… it’s readily available and relatively easy to machine. It’s pricey in the sizes you would need for rims, but it has been done on undersized yoyos (eli dert).
Kyle
Honestly I’m with Kyo in the matter of “you need to prove that it has actual benefit”, only I tried to use less attacking words and that I don’t need mathematical proofs, only rational explanation, so far however I still don’t get the idea.
That being said, when one plays a yoyo, ultimately one only sees: The amount of kickback, which is felt when throwing the yoyo, the total weight which is felt when moving the yoyo around doing tricks, “tiltiness” of the yoyo which is felt when doing tricks, and the yoyo shape, in this case we assume vibe doesn’t matter.
Let’s say, I have a certain 6061 yoyo, theoretically you could make the bi-metal version of it using say 7075 and stainless rims, and thin the rims to the point it plays very similar to the 6061 one. It might be a waste of material because if you can make the yoyo with that certain feel out of 6061, there is not much benefit to make it with bi-metal, at the very least you get increased durability which is not a total loss.
That same bi-metal combination of 7075 and stainless rim can be utilized to make a yoyo a 6061 can’t ever do because the density simply doesn’t allow, the simplest example is to make a lightweight bi-metal that has heavy rims. In this case, there is no substitute for the bi-metal.
Now the only thing that still bugs me is, what kind of design a tri-metal can do, that a bi-metal or single-metal can’t do as to justify the difficulty of machining the tri-metal itself?
I mean it will look different sure, but I simply can’t imagine of any case where there is a benefit when playability is concerned. What I’m saying is, if you can make the same kickback, same shape, same weight out of a bi-metal, the player will see it as the same or at least very closely similar yoyo with less difficulty to machine, then why using a method that is more difficult? the only conceivable benefit of using tri-metal is for the looks more than anything. There are probably things I’m missing but the explanations so far doesn’t really hit the nail.
Can a yoyo with a ring on the outside and another on the inside with very litte weight in between always be approximated by something with only one ring in between? It could be difficult to make both their radial moment around the axis and axial moment about the gap plane exactly the same since they are correlated into the cone shape of the yoyo, and even if it is done the distribution themselves are still different, and you probably can’t approximate the distributions well with just point masses.
Well, scientifically speaking, it looks really cool
Please show the math to prove that
It’s probably too complicated for most people to understand
With extensive testing of high end Yoyos. Mono, bi, tri, Ti. The Trimetal is unique in movement. No other kind plays the same. It requires adjusting when switching to the trimetal from other Yoyos. Is it worth the extra work, money, and time? Only the individual players can answer that. Personally I love unique feeling Yoyos. The list for me on unique Yoyos is this. M10, Draupnir, Hideyoshi all three standout amongst the crowd.
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I, for one, cant wait to try this design! 