Does anybody here actually like TMBR?


#1

‘Cause I gotta say… That ish is lame. I’ve gone through two Irvings(one broken before I took it out of the envelope), two Baldwins, and some CRAP proto with an undercut(and I really really mean crap) they sent me when I sent back my $50 Baldwin with a big ole’ chip around the axle hole.

I have to crush their gaps and put a dead Duncan sticker on EACH SIDE to get them to play remotely responsive enough. And even then, they’re about 35% too light, they feel like marshmallows on the end of the string. Marshmallows that are magnetically repelled by your hand. I propose people stop buying them, maybe we’ll get some good fixed axle yoyos cropping up.

They’re customer service is fine, they did send me a brand new Baldwin and all, but I can only assume that’s because they feel guilty for charging $50 for their lame product.


#2

Are you a True Throw Executive? Also where did you pay $50 for a Baldwin ? I may be wrong but arnt they $30 on here…


#3

Wth is a True Throw Executive?

From their website, it was one of the ones with a fancier inlay than most.


#4

With wood fixed axle yoyos, I find you really need to manage your string tension to the tigher side of things or they just don’t respond very well. All 5 of my TMBR yoyos are like this. These yoyos take a higher degree of pure skill to really fully appreciate, but are also great for developing these skills as well.


#5

“Crushing their gaps”…? Friction stickers…? Mikers, all you need to do if you want a smaller gap is take off the wooden axle and remove a bit of material with some sandpaper. Reinstall, voila more responsiveness! I had to do this with my EH (admittedly, I thought it was strange that it didn’t play more responsively out of the box) and it took all of 2 minutes, zero effort.

I can’t help imagining that if you had just taken those 2 minutes, you would have had a yoyo that you liked, very quickly.

I have 3 TMBRs and they all play fine.

As for weight, I dunno mang… Duncan Butterflies are too light for many people, but I enjoy playing a stock Butterfly. The TMBRs I own are certainly heavier than that. I don’t think there’s a “right” weight. This is wood. There are certain densities. The type of wood used, combined with the diameter, should be enough of a hint for weight. If not, don’t they publish the ballpark weights somewhere?

I don’t think TMBR should be regarded as “the ultimate wooden yoyo”, but they are nice throws. I’m quite glad to have mine.


#6

Perhaps the weight itself isn’t what I’m bothered by… It’s the feel of the weight of a yoyo made from such light, soft wood.

I seriously doubt you’d be telling Ed Haponik he’s wrong to be putting dead friction stickers in his fixed axles, but lo and behold, that’s how he sets up his No-Jive(although he uses spacers in that as well) and most likely the Eh.

I find them to be wholly unreliable, poorly thought out yoyos made from inferior materials. I’m quite upset I purchased the two that I did, even though when it was all said and done I had five. They’ve all been given away or tossed out.

Coming up on a decade I’ve worked out most string tensions issues, 42, my No-Jive had zero of the problems these do, and it wasn’t even one of the good ones…


(Waylon) #7

I gotta disagree with you. Unless your tension is to one extreme or the other, response should be largely unaffected by it. Unless your yoyo is too unresponsive or the gap is too wide, neutral tension should be enough to tug it back to your hand or stall it. Try a Kickflip Suicide with extra positive tension.

I also disagree that you have to be extra skillful to appreciate wood. I’m nobody special and I love fixed axle Yoyos. I can get my knuckles joyfully cracked just as hard with my graceless tricks as Ed can with his artful ones.


#8

Mikers,

With his TMBRs, Ed removes the wooden axle and sands off a bit of material (“a hair”) as needed.

I’m not saying ANYONE would be “wrong” to put a friction sticker into a yoyo, either. If that’s what it takes to make it play the way you want it to, then fine! I suspect No Jives don’t have a “shave down the axle” option. But still, friction stickers will quite obviously impart a different kind of response to a throw. If that’s what works for you, go for it! But that would be a personal choice and nothing to be angry about-- the TMBRs respond fine just as wood. Friction stickers optional. :wink:


#9

Whilst I don’t mean to jump on the bashing bandwagon, I am happy to know that I am not the only one who feels this way.

They also take a higher degree of pure skill to really fully realise how lacking they are. I wouldn’t go so far as to call them flawed (not by any means), but they could (should??) be better, in almost every department.

Unskilled players don’t know any better (and just land up frustrated, cause they’re not “legit” enough), and skilled players (and… generally sponsored) are able to play around these foibles and still make the product look good. Heck, they could swing around a broom and make it look good.

It is true that many tricks rely on tension (whether positive, neutral or negative). But still, I find it poor form when I can’t get a yoyo to respond properly with neutral tension and two friction stickers. No one has yet marketed a wooden yoyo as “completely unresponsive” (something I would still like to see), so why are we having these issues?

Agreed. With so many good woods out there, I’ve never understood why manufacturers stick to the soft, spongy types. If I buy a metal yoyo, I want it to be made from high grade aluminium, why should wood be any different?

I think manufacturers have been relying on the “wood is fickle and unpredictable” scapegoat for far too long (nevermind the poor QC and finishing).


#10

facepalm You should NOT be cranking these things down hard for more response. All that will get you is more dead yoyos.

I’ve personally been using Kitty String fat. It is still extremely responsive when I want (tighter tension) and completely unresponsive when I want (looser tension). You can pull off a suicide one throw, then start looping the next just by adjusting tension.

As far as weight goes, complaining about weight in a wooden yoyo is kinda like complaining about weight in an all plastic yoyo. You can’t expect anything but a hollow feel in both cases, IMO.

A fixed axle that can suicide, or loop, or do brent stoles, or stall and regen…yeah I love my Baldwin and it plays amazingly well.


#11

There are other factors to consider here. Mainly I’m thinking of humidity. During the daytime, my Baldwin is flat dead unresponsive even with kitty string fat and neutral tension. I live in the desert so less response is to be expected. At night, I have a very noticeable increase in tension due to the rise in humidity. Mind you, this is after just two days with my Baldwin but it is definitely noticeable.


#12

I’m not going to change my position. I have found that unless my string tension is on the tighter side of things, I have found the yoyos to be rather non-responsive unless I give a massive tug, which then ends up in a snaggy return most of the time. I do want the yoyo to remain responsive. I got plenty of unresponsive yoyos. If I want a wood yoyo that’s unresponsive, I’ll work with a modder to make it happen, but it would also have modern insides too.

I have a friend, who is also a forum user here, and he has had the same observations as I do, and we came to the same conclusion independently. He’s also much better than I am at the yoyo.

I also find that unless my technique is dead on, I can’t really do most of the tricks I can do with an unresponsive yoyo on a wood yoyo. If I end up giving slack(which is a problem I have), yeah, it’s gonna come at me with a vengeance!

Wood yoyos do frustrate the heck out of me. They just help prove how far down I am on the “skill level” of things. Currently, despite owning 5 fixed axle wood yoyos, I can’t say I hate them. I will say that they frustrate me to no end. They are doing exactly what they are designed to do and what they are supposed to do. I look at wood yoyos as not only a totally unique play, but also as a tool to help me improve in general.

We’ll just have to disagree on my position. That’s OK. At least both of us can justify our position. Right and wrong aren’t important. It’s more important that we exchange points of view.


#13

Good to know I’m not the only one who is disappointed.

Well spoken. A talented player should be able to do most of their tricks on just about anything. But that doesn’t mean that the just about anything is any good.

I think it’s strange that Ed has to do jack to his Eh. I mean… it’s his signature yoyo, right?

I’m not talking about slapping new stickers in there, I mean I play them in a Zero until they’re just cloth, then put them on a fixed axle. Similar to Tom Kuhn’s Turbo Disks. It doesn’t necessarily add response, but it evens it out and makes it more reliable. Throwing one on each side will(should) make it more responsive, though.

I’ve never broken a single yoyo via over-tightening. All the yoyos I got from them(excluding the one that broke right out of the package)are still functioning, and the original gap is still there. I’m not talking about doubling the force used to tighten the yoyo or anything, just an extra quarter to half turn.

I burn through a polyester string on a wooden fixed axle in ten throws, max.

Are you kidding on the weight thing? There was a more substantial feeling wooden yoyo designed in the 70s, I think its about time we step… er, back?. It’s entirely dependent on the wood used. And there are plenty of plastic yoyos out there that have a flat out fantastic feeling on the string. What are you referring to, the ONE? Lol.


#14

Nobody gonna’ elaborate on that for me?


#15

Mikers, I’ve also made the point that it’s strange Ed should have to do anything to his signature throw, so we are on the same page there. Be that as it may, it took less than 2 minutes to get my EH to play responsively. I can loop fine on it without that “lag” at the end of the string.

I do think that Colin would keep more fans if he would just make these things more responsive out of the box. However, if you ever watch his personal videos, it’s clear that he likes to push the limits of responsiveness… doing Black Hops on a fixed-axle throw isn’t going to work very easily with the kind of responsiveness you and I prefer. :wink: I don’t think he should saddle that preference on people, but…

Then again, we’re not saddled with it. Easier to shave a hair off an axle than add a spacer, yes?

Regarding wood choice, maple, oak, and mahogany are all hardwoods. It’s not like he’s making these things out of pine. :wink: I would like to see some more purpleheart, but its sawdust is toxic. Not saying you can’t work it, but maybe if he’s churning out yoyos he’s avoiding certain wood types. I’d have to ask. More likely, it’s the ready availability of the woods he normally uses.

Other woods like rosewood are controlled species now. I honestly have no complaints about his wood choices.

I don’t think they’re perfect, though. I believe there’s still an extra stage of fine sanding or finishing that could take place, but which would raise the price. I chose to pore-fill my Baldwin because it had an end-grain rough patch (not uncommon for circular cuts) that I thought was just a bit TOO rough and interfered with UFOs. Filled the pores with CA, sanded smooth. Almost did the same with my EH, but decided to play through it and eventually the string smoothed it out. The LoveJoy hasn’t needed any special attention.


(Waylon) #16

Greg, wood choice is likely more about cost and availability. Lots if hardwoods produce toxic dust, including walnut and my ex wife’s head.

As to the rest, I’ll have to come back to this later, when I’m not so tired and grouchy. I don’t want to alienate fellow fixed axle players by choosing poor words and turning a debate into an argument.


#17

Any wood turner (who likes living, anyway) is going to wear a good respirator while turning, and especially sanding.
something like this is what I see most often
http://g-ec2.images-amazon.com/images/G/01/th/3M/resp/6211.V395766850.jpg
as well as an accompanying face shield. Some wear a face shield with a built in respirator.
Not to mention almost all fine wood dust is bad for your lungs and is linked to causing cancer. So the toxicity of the wood isn’t particularly a big deal.

I would guess that it has to do more with cost of wood like Waylon was saying, as well as the density, ease of turning, texture, grain pattern, etc. The more exotic woods like purple heart or zebra wood are rather pricey, but also very dense.

I haven’t tried a tmbr throw, so I can’t comment on how they play or whether or not I like them. Just thought I would share a little bit of what I’ve learned from my very limited wood turning experience. :slight_smile:


#18

TMBR throws are some of the best out there! Ive loved every model Colin churns out and they are all TOP quality. I propose you stop buying them Mikers that way there are more for the people that appreciate Colin’s work ;D


#19

I have stopped buying them.

That said - I do believe Colin deserves some credit - until he came around, fixed wooden axle yoyos simply weren’t avaiable. Although his design / manufacturing seems to have hit a slump, he has done a lot and deserves credit.

Still, they do leave a lot to be desired, the time is ripe for someone to step up to the plate right now. If Colin doesn’t do it, someone else will.


#20

I much prefer my No-Jive to my TMBR Fremont, but I don’t think that makes TMBRs “bad” necesarily.