Dude. Anthony you are really the only reason in the past I have even thought about purchasing a Rec Rev. After so long though its just to much. Steve is right on this one Alex Kim is a liar and a thief. There is no way to run a company if you can’t even ship out one order to a anxious customer. Please take your talents else where…
Josh, sometimes I think you should spend less time howling at the moon and more time thinking before you speak.
You ever hear the old saying,’ that bucket doesn’t hold water’? Well, your bucket(story) doesn’t even hold air.
As I read your reply, I went from locating incorrect statements to trying to find if you actually made any factual statements at all?
‘Rec rev is NOT Alex Kim’…? Rec rev Is Alex Kim. He started it, he calls the shots, Rec rev is HIM.
‘The Company doesn’t necessarily need to be avoided’. Dealing with Alex through the mail needs to be avoided.
Ordering stuff from Far away, like Germany, over the Internet, should be avoided.
And by the way, saying CLYW isn’t Chris? I think you need to check your body for a Brightness adjustment knob. And if you find one, turn up the ‘brightness’.
’ There should never be anything that would hinder us from playing what we like’? <> so basically you could care less about anybody else he screwed as long as you get your stuff, he is a Genuine guy. Except for the forgetfulness and procrastination that burns other people.
‘His heart is in the right place’? We aren’t worried about his heart being in the right place. We should be more concerned with the yoyos people buy from him, being in the right place, in boxes being sent to the guys that already paid for them.
‘His company playing a big role in your life’ does nothing to thrill the guys that he has NEVER sent yoyos to.
‘Give his yoyos a try’? <> no doubt the people he still owes Would Love to give his yoyos a try, lol.
That kid from German is out 170 bucks. <> too late to file with Paypal. If, IF Alex did send yoyos and they uh, vanished(ya right), the sender has to initiate contacting the Post office. They won’t give the recipient the time a day. < Alex has done nothing. If Alex can’t Prove he actually did send anything to Germany, then he should paypal the kid back his 170 bucks.
And ‘if’ the guy was Genuine, then he would more compelled to Correct his Sour ‘I got yo money and you ain’t gettin jack’ techniques. And a Genuine guy wouldn’t let his Bad Rep(actually has a yoyo by that name cuz he finds his own 'Lameness legendary status funny)actually compel one of his own Team Players to come to the Forum and Cover for his Lazyness. When your own friends have to step up and do a little Damage control, you(Alex) need to step up and do you own damage control. In this situation, square up with whoever you Owe. Nothing less.
Josh, saying that it would be a huge shame to miss out if they not get RecRev yoyos is very shortsighted and inconsiderate.
If you think that way, then you should also entertain the view that ‘it would also be a Huge Shame if the people he owes yoyos to, never get the chance to Enjoy his Special yoyos’.
And Alexs’ list of Forgotten ones, uh, you know, the one with less money and No RecRev yoyos they paid for?
They are the ones presently experiencing the Huge Shame mode.
And I would bet that at the end of each day, Alex sleeps like a log and wakes smiling.
And every day, people here and there wonder when/if they are ever going to get their yoyos?
He needs to step up to the plate and even up. Anything short of doing something right, is doing it wrong.
Ps… I knew this guy years ago. He used to rob banks. But when he wasn’t robbing banks, he was the nicest guy. Well, he would stab people now and then in bar fights, but when he wasn’t stabbing people, he was the nicest guy. Oh, he used to slap his girl around now and then. But most of the time when we would see them together, she didnt look too beat up. And she would tell us that when he wasn’t slapping the heck out of her, he was the nicest guy.
Ps 2… I just made that up for perspective/clarity. < my cats cover up their ‘business’ in the cat box. But it’s still there. It’s just buried.
In a real Business, you don’t bury(avoid) your mistakes. You correct them. < it’s called Building a Good Reputation. RecRev ‘is’ Alex Kim. And Alex Kim makes very good yoyos, but ‘he’ does not have a good Reputation.
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I still gotta disagree with some of you unfortunately, but its ok, people all see things different, and it just goes to show how diverse the community is.
Im not trying to tell people to necessarily change their views, but being exposed to another idea may prove beneficial for some, and for others maybe not, but why I support recrev is stated, and will continue to be the case with me.
Agree to disagree it comes down to.
And there is nothing wrong with that.
bark
Sorry Spiritboy, but you are not passing Go on this one.
‘Agree to disagree’? <> you Totally missed the Entire point of contention, Yoda.
I am not disagreeing with you. To disagree is to suggest we have a difference of opinion.
My post identifies that your view is Groundless and unsubstantiated. My Factual response simply identifies the difference between fact and fiction. My facts counter your fiction.
Alex is ok with you because he makes good products and he has not Burned you, yet. Putting blinders on and not looking past the end of your nose, does nothing to improve the situation.
Your motivations seem to be self centered and self serving. You could care less about ‘others getting the short end of the stick’. You preach about the Mystical adventures within the realm of yoyo life, whatever,.
But here we have a guy that literally seems to enjoy Burning people in yoyo deals, and yet, you don’t hesitate to support him.
You stated that this situation just shows how diverse the yoyo community is…<>FAIL, try again
The yoyo community is not showing its diversity on this subject. It is showing that it is divided into 1 small group and 1 larger group. The smaller group is represented by Mystical You, Wolfboy Jr. You contend that it is ok for somebody to Screw others as long as they make good yoyos and don’t screw you.
… Group 2 is represented by people that recognize 'taking peoples money on not giving them anything is wrong. Technically it is Fraud, a Criminal offense, come to think of it.
You stated that being exposed to another idea may prove beneficial to some’. <> Josh, me thinks you need to defragmenter your Hard drive.
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Mo, people can choose to support shady people and poor business practices… that’s what Josh wants to do, that’s his choice. It’s just like people who shop at walmart… they know they aren’t supporting something good, but what’s being offered is good enough that they don’t care.
We may not agree with it, but it is in fact a difference of opinion… their priorities are different than ours.
Kyle
My thoughts on RecRev:
I’ve been aware of the issues. I avoid these issues by buying either from companies like YYE or others. I figure since these places actually have product in hand and are ready to sell then it’s safe to buy because I know I’ll get it. They did the hard work of securing the product, I just have the hard job of transferring money to the store after I do the even harder task of choosing which one(s) to purchase. Other than that, BST is fairly safe. I’ve also bought from RecRev direct at BAC 2012 and 2013 because I could see the product, hold the product and then walk away with product.
I’ve also heard some rather interesting stories about what some of the reseller shops have done to get their product from RecRev. It’s a bit crazy.
The way RecRev is behaving is simply unacceptable. It’s a shame they behave this way. I really like this company, or at least, maybe I should say I really enjoy their products. I would like to think that a company that makes such amazing products would also be able to have fantastic customer service. Too bad this isn’t the case. If they keep this up it’s just going to come back to haunt them, then hurt them and then destroy them. We’ve already seen a company pretty much knock itself out of the community due to the antics of the owner earlier this year.
Personally, I wouldn’t buy from RecRev direct unless it was a face to face encounter at a contest. Do they even have a web site? Their Facebook presence is, well, they have a Facebook page. I’ve bought direct from other companies: CLYW, OneDrop, Duncan, Yomega and GSquared come to mind. However, all of these places maintain an online presence, an online shop and are pretty much people I am in frequent contact with. These are entities I feel comfortable dealing with.
Sorry. I like RecRev products. Well, at least, to be more clear, I do enjoy the RecRev products I have, which are also the only ones I’ve tried. Yes, this does mean that I’m directly or indirectly supporting a business that operates in ways I disagree with. I guess that makes me a bit of a hypocrite. I can’t quite relate on the same level. What I do is 100% customer service, with really no tangible product. I know if I treated my customers like that I’d be done. I deal with shady people on a regular basis though. I get tired of people looking to screw me over. However, when dealing with these shady people, I have tactics that prevent me from being screwed over most of the time: contracts with large security deposits! I have additional tactics that I use on top of that to prevent being screwed. I mean, part of my contracts have a clause in them that says I get paid the balance before the truck is unloaded. If I’m not paid upon arrival, I wait 15 minutes and if no money(cash or certified check), I roll back home. The sad thing is the number of times I’ve had to use that tactic too.
This sucks for me because there are additional RecRevs I want to get fairly soon. I’ll probably end up getting them anyways.
I say to avoid issues, simply buy from reputable yoyo shops that have product in stock, or buy direct from them at contests, or BST from people who aren’t RecRev.
Kyle, I understand and agree with the way you ‘worded’ your response, to a point.
But then again, consider the source. Josh Yee. He’s been around yoing for YEARS, like you and I.
He’s gone from a little kid beginner to a guy that can enter a Yoyo Contest and place in up to all 5 divisions.
Josh has been helping others learn to yoyo, since I can remember. On this board alone he has a yoyo Trade count of well over 100.
Josh has posted several thousand times on this Forum. Sometimes I think he is a little ‘far out there somewhere’. But he has contributed some very interesting views, concepts and generally constructive insights.
If,IF, josh was new to Yoing and just didnt ‘get it’, I would say little in this thread.
His extensive exposer and experience in yoing, is what draws my ire in this instance.
Josh ‘knows better’. He doesn’t Burn people. And more often than not, he would prefer to Get along with others than to argue.
But in this thread, he chooses to be contrary. He is aware that Alex has burned others. He is aware that this is a long running problem that has caused bad feeling and stress and Grief to others. Others in the Worldwide yoyo community that just want to make good deals like Josh generally does and have fun and be happy.
And yet, he turns a blind eye to Alexs’ lameness factor. Josh tries to somewhat justify his financial support for RecRev, by suggesting that Alex sells really good yoyos and RecRev isn’t really ‘Alex’ anyway.
The Fact that Josh knows better is why I said he won’t pass go on this one.
I am not suggesting that nobody should ever buy a RecRev product fo-Eva.
I just think it is a Slap in the face to anybody Alex owes yoyos to, for Josh coming into this thread and supporting the guy,
I believe Josh could hav easily been more constructive in this thread by stepping up and suggesting that Alex should make things right with ‘His deals gone Bad’ practices. And showed some Genuine concern for the Victims of a guy he calls Genuine, Ironically.
Josh preaches about happiness and harmony and unravelling the mystical mysteries in life. And yet he selects 'product quality over fairness and people’s feelings.
I just feel his stance contradicts the views he normally espouses.
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[quote=“yoyodoc,post:62,topic:57083”]
that’s not entierly true. For the past year, I have ordered over 150 yoyos from various countries, companies, retailers, and people. So far, each and every one was eventually delivered to me except the 2 yoyos from RecRev (and those from the Civility KickStarter, but that’s a different story altogether ). Therefore, I don’t agree on this notion. In fact, I’d say there’s no reason why you shouldn’t order stuff from far away when you live in Germany because package delivery is rather reliable here.
In this special case and as stated before, the reason for me not having gotten the package so far can have many reasons, none of which are necessarily RecRev/Alex’s fault. But I don’t know because they/he isn’t communicating at all. And that’s the thing I’m currently most disappointed about.
[quote=“HaruRay,post:63,topic:57083”]
I suppose that the comments about RecRev not being a bad company are directed to people that are contemplating whether or not they want to buy a RecRev yoyo. To people like me who have spend money and haven’t received their goods for whatever reason, this isn’t really applicable. There’s hardly anything that could be said that will make me change my view to “Oh, ok, now I understand and it’s a good thing that I’ve lost $170 because of this”.
As for my personal view on this situation: I’m in this to get it resolved. I’m not angry or want to have revenge on RecRev/Alex. I want to understand what has happened and how we can get this sorted out. Maybe USPS (or whatever was used) messed up, maybe German Customs messed up, maybe the package got stolen from my door step. Maybe it was never sent off, maybe it was sent off but much later than anticipated and is still underway. The only thing that I know is that I don’t have those yoyos. When Alex finally comes around and tells me his take on it, I’m sure that we can get something worked out. However, the longer this takes, the fewer the options become. For instance, insurance claims won’t be accepted after a certain period of time. And then things get more and more complicated.
But I’m repeating myself. In any case, I’ll keep at it and will keep you updated
I like how this thread has basically turned into “let’s demonize Alex Kim”.
I tried (twice) to propose what I thought was a reasonable and productive I idea but it seems to have just been buried under a pile of argument and hate.
Sorry but you Totally misunderstood what I meant. What I meant was ‘you’ ordering from so FAR away as Germany from a guy like Alex who couldn’t carry a yoyo across the street and hand it to you, should be avoided.
I didn’t mean ‘you’ should not order a yoyo from anybody.
But you are a perfect example that people from Germany should not expect to actually get anything if they order ‘Directly’ from Alex.
Sorry you misunderstood my wording…
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Your idea (which is ‘buying from retailers’ for all of you who don’t want to go back in this thread) is a good one and I support that. Sometimes the best way to get the more exclusive yoyos is to go through the manufacturer directly, though. And there are perfect examples where this works very well. RecRev is just not one of them, obviously. I’ve learned that now and wish I’d had known that earlier.
And had I known that the Parsleys were being sold by retailers a little after I had bought them directly from RecRev, I woudn’t have bothered but instead gone to retail straight away. To add to the frustration, I saw that the yoyos were slowly being sold off (even with some discount sales in between) one by one while I waited and waited for mine to arrive. 
@yoyodoc: ok, , gottcha. Thanks for clarifying it.
I like how you are putting a slight twist on the actual focus and primary points of several posts in this thread.
Nobody, including me, is trying to ‘Demonize’ Alex Kim.
Your exaggeration misrepresents the reality based facts in this matter.
Alex is not a Demon. Alex is not Evil. Alex is not a Criminal mastermind.
Alex is ‘selectively’ a Flake. He takes care of Business sometimes. And he takes money from people now and then and gives then/sends them nothing. < and doesn’t seem bother about making things right.
These are just facts. You don’t have to like them.
I thought your suggestions about Alex hiring somebody to clean up his mess and keep it clean were Excellent.
But that is too easy. Alex knows better and should suck it up and prove he knows he is screwing up by getting Products to these people himself. OR, just getting their money back to them through Paypal.
Not sure how long you have been around the yoyo boards, but I have been around since 1998. And Steve Brown has been around even longer.
Steve and I have been good friends since the late 90’s. We have seen a whole Busload worth of people playing games with other people’s money over the years.
We have both been aware of Alexs’ antics since he was a kid. His ‘take yo money and send you nothing program’ is not an Urban Legend. It is ‘his way’.
In order for his to get more Credibility, He, HE, not Anthony, has to correct his Antics that cost people money and get them nothing.
I actually like the guy. He has come a long way. His yoyos are not only very good, they are good values at their various pricepoints.
He just needs to do his own Community Service and refresh his reputation.
I didn’t ask anybody to get a rope or call an Exorcist.
I just think his mommy needs to spank him and tell him he’s been a bad boy.
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At least my hyperbole caught some attention
I agree with what you’ve said here, thanks for clearing things up. Sorry for exaggerating.
Just because I have been around for a long time, and have helped out many in this community, doesn’t mean that I have to have a viewpoint that somehow lines up with yours, or anyone else’s for that matter.
I see what you have presented, I understand you logic, but it just doesn’t go that way for me and how I see things.
I say yes, Alex has not personally done to me, but even if he had, it wouldn’t change the fact that I live the yoyos he makes and that they have a history with me, so yes, I’d still pick one up given the chance.
Call me crazy, call me delusional, I’m not gonna take it.
Again, for me, it’s about throwing what I like, and I still stand by what I said in that I don’t consider a yoyo to “be” it’s owner or the company in regard to its product.
wuff
Thats really saddening choice of opinions to hear come forth from a forum expert. To openly announce that you suppor a thief & a liar and have you acknowledge that even If he had stolen from you that it wouldn’t change your your mind on the situation as a whole :(.
I saw in another thread that you are openly Christian, but give a huge pass to the immoral treatment of others in the form of saying its ok for Alex Kim to continue to steal, lie, & take advantage of people, certainly not something Jesus allowed (In fact Jesus was extremely proactive in denouncing and fighting for the rights of those that had no recourse or ability to defend themselves against liars, thieves, & those out to take advantage of them) nor was willing to support those that did such things. I’m not saying dont buy these yoyos if you like them then by all mean buy them, but please don’t advocate that the Alex Kim (or others out to do the same) should just be able continue to rob, cheat, lie, & steal as long as they make a good product and some people get theirs eventually. To make this clear I am not attacking you or your Christian beliefs I just think you need to reevaluate your thoughts on this topic to be more Christ like. If we cannot have a defined line between what is right and what isn’t then we got lost along the journey.
I really tried to not say anything other then that I disagreed with you, but this is really absurd that you would say that Alex Kim is a good guy and defend him when he could care less and will continue to rip people off and leave the situation like our German friend is going through :(, but I guess it’s really easy to support and even go way out on a really skinny limb and say crazy things when it’s not your money or yoyos that are missing. It seems that you a nonexistent empathy comcerning this topic toward those that have exploited, lied to, & stolen from.
I hope that you are able at some point be able to divide in your mind the difference between liking a yoyo and supporting the yoyo manufacturer that have continuously taken people’s money and never makes good their orders.
Some food for thought - it’s really evident and easy to understand why Alex Kim is a good guy in person and makes good deals at the events and contests. I’m sure he doesn’t want to get beat up, arrested, or not welcomed back to these events and contests (eventually he will burn this bridge too), but with online orders he has zero accountablilty (well he has a player or two telling him to do what’s right, but that obviously hasn’t worked) since these people aren’t local and in his mind here aren’t the same recourses as if he were to rip someone off in person or eve someone local to him; and In his mind this becomes a victimless crime (or else he’d make good) and allows him to think he is above reproach since these people do not generally have easy access to a way to to hold Alex kim accountable to reclaim what is theirs, since they are so far away or from other countries and it could be very cost prohibited for these people to get what’s belongs to them since it will generally cost more money and the amount of effort that would be required to get their yoyos or funds funds back.
I hope those that have been wrong find a way to get their money or yoyos and Alex Kim steps up and repairs the issues and makes those customers he ripped off happy and finds a way to make good yoyos but not at the expense of lying, stealing, & cheating to do it.
I should point out here that I don’t actually think Alex just goes around looking for ways to screw people. He just doesn’t care to follow through with anything. If you’re in person, it’s quick and easy… deal, money, yoyo, done. Online he has the luxury of being exceptionally lazy about it… he gets paid, then he deals with the rest whenever he happens to feel like it, if he ever does.
I say that not to justify any of it, because it’s absurd, shady, dishonest, etc… and nobody should support that… but because I wanted to clarify that it’s not a fear of somebody ‘beating him up’ in person, it’s just that in person requires no effort.
Kyle
I agree, except for the part about knowing Alex. While I met him at BAC, the impression he left with me is something I’ve seen a few thousand times in my years doing(and still doing) live sound, and it wasn’t something I prefer to see.
I do completely agree. Alex is in control over his own destiny here. He makes fantastic products, perhaps some of my most favorite yoyos. His business practices now are currently taking him down a path of business demise. However, he CAN change. The question is WILL he change? That I cannot answer.
I’ve only been in this spinning toy scene for about 2.5 years now. I’ve seen a lot, I know a lot. I know a LOT more than I’m willing to say here on the forum. I’ve been hearing this stuff about Alex since I purchased my first RecRev, which was around 2 years ago. I bought it from YYE, so I was completely unaware of the behind the scenes stuff.
I agree that he needs a proverbial spanking to alert him to his poor customer service practices. This might be the wake-up call he needs to get him to initiate change in a positive direction. I feel the negativity he has created for himself is completely reversible
At the same time, I do agree with Josh. Yoyo is supposed to be something positive for me. I want to throw what I like and like what I throw. Given the opportunity, I would pick up more RecRev models. Fortunately, I choose to do things in low-risk methods, so I have effectively shielded myself from the problems and drama and avoided the issues.
In this situation, we have Anthony Rojas stepping in and expressing pretty much acknowledging what far too many people know, and like these people know, he’s not pleased with it either. I gotta give him some credit for stepping out on a limb like that. Hopefully what he says to his sponsor can make an impact, because nothing the rest of us(except the retailers who buy in large numbers) can say or do that will be read and acted upon.
At this point, only time will tell.
Snafu, do not bring my own choices of belief into this.
Do you think Im trying to say what Alex is doing is right? No, by all means I am upset that he has done these things to people, and I do feel for what our german member is going through.
What part of “I like yoyos that I like, and will buy what I like” is so hard to understand?
Don’t bring my morals into this, don’t bring my beliefs into this, I am simply stating that I like some freaking yoyos here!
Please, let’s not make this a huge issue.
bark
I’d quote where you literally said that Alex was ok and getting a pass on his actions and I do believe morality and beliefs are a big part of this discussion but you’d argue and say I was wrong even quoting your own words.