I really doubt Yoyofactory is telling people the bigger picture about things but they are like most other brands facing the fallout of China going bust if you really don’t know about their business and economic troubles since Colvid lockdowns. The other is Evan and Angel have family and friends who are black they hangout with so to them living in modern times may have a different outlook on things other may see as controversial but each individual will see things their own way. It is what it is. Yoyofactory to date in my opinion best innovations is the Genpop as of recently scored well in the Rewind best of 2024 survey in the Japan market. I guess people are not paying attention out there what player are saying who have the Genpop or Moz yo-yos. Also, people seem to not notice Yoyofactory does allot of collaborating with other brands to also help them grow and produce products with their connections and know how.
am i missing something? what collabs with smaller brands is YYF doing lately?
YYF is one of the most anti-collab brands ive ever seen, they have actually bullied so many small companies for silly reasons like name similarities over things they own a patent for. Heck, they even tried to intimidate a small upcoming brand over the term “B Grade”. YYF will literally bully a a small brand and release evan and angelo another yoyo than helping a small brand get off the ground.
making a video with the KKK as a social media stunt to get views is pretty cut and dry gross and it makes sense that people would find that upsetting. It was promotion for a hate group. I think you missed the point why people were appalled.
You want to talk about collabs look at mk1 or freshly dirty. Arthur helps folks with designs and never takes credit or hets mentioned and mark has worked with so many folks many he isn’t credited on.
On the other end yyf and Duncan patent designs then beat down anyone who makes something even slightly similar.
Yyf does sponsor players then make yo-yos for those players but they take a decent cut from those folks that operate as their own brands. Aka gentry, and others…. It’s a service though. They do logistics and operations and let the player “brand” just market stuff.
It seems like this would apply equally to all but a tiny number of brands, and in ways that aren’t really relevant to YYF’s ability to compete on design or brand perception.
The more transparent manufacturers seem to be churning out yo-yos.
Could be. But why might that be the case? It is interesting to me that apparently good yo-yos win popularity contests and get good reviews in Japan, but are barely mentioned in the US.
Are yo-yo preferences so much different? Is it evidence that YYF’s brand headaches are less of a liability in Japan? Maybe because people are less tuned in to the issues? Or because these particular YYF brand ambassadors are less relevant?
This is accurate and isn’t just a Japan thing and rather just an “outside the states” thing as far as I can tell. I think that is because we have more options in the US from different shops and smaller brands. I was talking to great players in the EU that never even played a OD for example. So even if they were tuned in to the issues and cared, the lack of options may be prohibitive. From the Japanese perspective the culture is very different, but I’m surprised that YYF hasn’t released the Moz or Pragma 7075 here in the states to name a few.
They seem to be running a different program in Japan. Is there a different management team directing it?
I haven’t researched it but it looks like they have active group over there. They have a unique website and Izuru Hasumi is actively contributing. So while over here it is Gentry, formerly Evan and a few other influencers; over there they have Izuru, Akitoshi and others. And the distribution goes out through that other big retailer.
It’s obviously a big market for yoyos so it would make sense from a business perspective to cater more directly to it.
…And frustratingly, these Japanese retailers seem to get first-crack at new models; in large-quantities.
Seems like the States are an afterthought. I know Japan is a bigger market but you would think an American company would ensure retailers like YYE are playing on a level-field by having the same inventory, at the same time.
It’s strange that YYF has its own store in the US which also either gets certain yo-yos in limited quantities or not at all.
Makes me wonder if there are Japan and US management teams/individuals who are on different pages about what to do with the brand.
My guess is that they run somewhat independently, but I may be completely off base. It also seems that the Gentry is becoming the complete face of YYF here in the states and is pushing his signatures and projects more than anything else. Which can definitely be seen as the stagnation that other posters have mentioned.
Nowadays YYF releases mostly feel like either rehashes of DNA-friendly yo-yos with minimal changes and new names or basic design shapes that have been on the market for over a decade just made wider. While I do love some of their yo-yo models, the lineup has started to feel a bit repetitive and uninspired lately.
Plus significant redesigns just for the sake of adding “DNA caps”.
DNA and wide yo-yos do seem to be the focus of their US marketing. And while there is an audience for that, it does seem like YYF is diluting their own efforts with constant “latest, greatest” versions.
I think someone who knows YYF from their Japanese website yo-yo page would have a totally different impression of what they are about.
yyf lost the sauce
I could care less about YYF, but can’t the same be said for a majority of bigger brands. I could replace YYF in this quote with a number of brands and I still think it holds true. I’m curious which ones are really pushing the boundaries in innovation? Also what is the criteria for innovation? What would be required for them or any brand to do to be considered innovators at this point?
Speaking for myself, I would credit YoYoRecreation for the variety of very good yo-yos that they are producing.
Right, but I think you just moved the goal post. Are we talking quality or innovation? Looking that YYR website by newest releases they are mostly updates to existing models and sigs. I’m just super curious what buyers are wanting that innovates on the current yoyo space that hasn’t really been done before.
tons of innovation, just gotta look around!
- W!ld → tons of new designs and models, picked up tons of players, made a like, straight up 100% plastic yoyo (even plastic axle), good stuff happening, so much so it’s impossible to keep up with
- onedrop → just a few years ago we had riots on this forum literally BEGGING onedrop to make a wide yoyo, this year they made multiple!
- Topyo → topyo is an OEM that kinda gets a bit forgotten from time to time, but I think they had some amazing unique releases this year, the block had a lego hub, they had a two piece plastic called the faceless, etc.
- empathy → these guys are fairly new but literally every release from them has been a banger, haven’t heard anything bad, the eminence featured a pretty interesting rim fit, and everyone that I’ve seen touch a noir has fallen in love
definitely not an exhaustive list at all
It’s kind of hard to point to like “never been done before” innovation, but there’s definitely stuff happening, IMO I would consider YYR in here too just because of the savage and using PC/POM rims to push the catch zone a bit.
I should have said “very good and also innovative”.
Niche designs like Gopa/GPPR or Chopsticks/Chobi Gorilla. Savage/55. The Autoscopy line has quite a bit of innovation within itself. The typeface series.
They have been updating popular models. But they have been experimenting with different stuff all along.
I’m not really picking a side here but I don’t necessarily view most of these as very significant.
I’m of the opinion that yo-yo design is like 90% solved. Most yoyo innovation seems to come as a result of adapting to trends in play and the resulting demand.
People started shimming their yo-yos and we got yo-yos with bigger gaps. Everyone started making silicone response systems when it became clear how advantageous that was with widening gaps.
Andre made grinds popular (the original finger spin) and yo-yos had to be grind friendly. This goes on all the way up to yo-yos becoming large diameter again and wider than ever to accommodate the new wave of competition playstyles.
As far as I can tell there haven’t really been changes in play recently that would require manufacturers to address a potential limitation in yo-yo design.