ok you’re right, my bad
I do yoga sorta ???
This could work w/ a yoyo.
no. while i appreciate the dismissive condescension, what you just posted represents everything that i detest about modern ‘show’ martial arts.
i prefaced the entire point by saying ‘for me’. it doesn’t matter to me how you interpret their application, but ‘for me’, the martial arts are not something i do ‘for fun’. likewise, i don’t practice them to ‘look good’. not everything that makes you a better, more complete person needs to be about fun or looking good. (that’s not to say i don’t HAVE fun practicing martial arts - i do. i just don’t allow fun to guide my practice/study). i have plenty of aspects of my life that are all about fun (hi, yo-yoing).
and it’s not a matter of unwillingness to dream. i’ve seen a hundred martial arts demos that are ‘all flash, no smash’. i’m not impressed by someone in a sequin outfit doing some kind of artificial, 540-degree jump-spinning-hook-kick and i’d be even less impressed if they were doing 2a at the same time. it’s not that i believe it’s impossible. it’s that i believe that it represents the dilution of traditional martial principles; lessons that i think were useful and relevant and which our society is neglecting/forgetting. budo is about BU (protection/defense). occasionally, your practice will be fun and occasionally it might even look cool. but if you’re letting ANYTHING besides ‘BU’ dictate the terms of your study… then i think your time would be better spent doing other things.
yo-yo’s are for play. yo-yo’s are for fun. the martial arts i study are decidedly not. it doesn’t make them less valuable.
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I don’t see what’s wrong with useing for show. Now, If you just use it to show off, i’d agree thats the wrong reason. But useing it for entertainmant and showing off are two completly differant things. Just because it can be used for self defense doesn’t mean it can only be used for defense and fighting. I don’t see whats wrong with doing it for fun. Just because its originally used for defense seems like a silly reason to only use it for fighting. It’s not hurting anyone else by doing it for fun. Anyways it’s just my opinion.
Though I do agree with some of your statement, because I have never been what you refer to as a “flowery” martial artist- I have to respectfully disagree with your statement “i don’t see any use in trying to artificially apply yo-yoing directly to the martial arts or vice versa”.
Kung Fu was hidden for years as dance under the threat of death if you practiced any martial arts.
Both Brazilian and African Capoera are routinely and traditionally practiced with music as a dance.
The survival of modern Martial Arts, especially the Chinese arts, can be directly attributed to it’s usage in early asian opera such as Kabuki and the Peking Opera.
The main reason Martial Arts gained popularity in the west is from the rise of the “Chop Sockey” films in the 1960’s and 70’s and a few souls brave enough to capitalize on that idea.
Even todays Martial Arts resurgence can be attributed to the late 90’s to todays blend of eastern and western cinema and the rise of popularity of MMA fighting. (While MMA fighting is considered a competition sport, like baseball, football, tennis, etc. its entertainment value is what causes it to thrive as a professional sport.)
I am NOT a fan of XMA. Like you, Ed, I find it frivolous and pointless. I do not watch UFC or any of its ilk. I find it an unnecessary brutalization and glorification of the wrong aspects of the Martial Arts. HOWEVER I do appreciate them and respect them for both what they are, and what they have done to keep Martial Arts a recognizable and widely accepted practice.
In no way do I want to say “I am right, and you are wrong”. I respect your opinion and I truly enjoy a lot of what you have to say about the Martial Arts in general both here and on your blog. I merely wanted to offer my opinion in counterpoint to yours. Two Martial Arts practitioners with many years “under our belts” offering valid opinions based on years of personal experience.
Yes, there is no practical use or point to combining Yo-yo and Martial Arts from a traditional or Buntai point of view. I simply feel that it could be fun, not only for the yo-yo/Martial Artist, but it might be fun to watch- and it may interest some Yo-players in the Martial Arts, or some Martial Artists in Yo-yoing. It has already gotten some of our yo-yo brethren thinking.
Isn’t that what it’s really all about- keeping both art forms alive for the next generation?
what i think it’s ‘about’ is keeping the SPIRIT of the respective arts alive… which, to me, means as near to their original content and intent as possible. i feel that i’m a caretaker of the traditions i practice. i believe that those arts are more substantial than i am, and it’s not for me to make them into a game or to sell out their core to make them more entertaining.
it’s one thing to talk about creating a new kata in the spirit of an art, or of the martial arts’ connections with other arts such as dance, the tea ceremony, or even yo-yoing. fundamentally though, if those other arts are not about life and death, not about protection or defense… then i don’t feel they’re meant to be demonstrated simultaneously. i don’t mean it to be dismissive of yo-yoing. i’ve spent a huge part of my life with a yo-yo in my pocket or on my finger and i understand its power and use. but it is fundamentally a toy. i don’t want to see or participate in martial arts demonstrations that involve paddleball, frisbees, or juggling balls either. to my mind, such things would not serve to “keep both art forms ALIVE for the next generation”. rather they would demean and misrepresent the function of each.
the martial arts i practice (specifically aikido and iaido) are not for play and not for show. some arts are; if i understood the phenomenon i suppose i would practice such arts and not object to the idea of ‘tacking on’ the use of a plaything just to see if i could. i don’t expect or require that others share my views, but juxtaposing two forms, the fundamental spirits of which are disconnected feels, to me, obscene.
i’ve said my piece on it.
Ive been working on mixing traditional forms from Tae Kwon Do, (Tang So Do, Moo Duk Kwan style) into my yoyoing and have made some progress, but Im still working on it. I read through the topic of current conversation, and I dont really have an opinion, but I will say that my approach to integrating a yoyo into Forms is taken with great care so as to preserve the integrity/intent/and definition of the Form itself… I dont want to make a mockery of it, I want to attempt to retain the purpose of the Form. This is what makes it a difficult process.
I just today reached High Brown, we had our graduation in Breckenridge, CO; the culmination of an 8 week Prep Cycle… Saturday was the hardest testing Ive ever done… 8 am to 11 pm nearly nonstop with a 3 hour break. This was my first Prep Cycle and first trip to Breckenridge and Im happy to say it wasnt as hard as I expected, which means Im doing something right, HA! I have about year to go before I reach 1st Dan, and I can already taste it…
Anyway, I noticed this topic and thought Id post, as after testing was over with Saturday night, a few of us whipped out the Bo Staffs and traded technicals, and we already have several Bo staff integration into forms, so I demonstrated what I had with my yoyo so far, and the guys were really pleased and interested. Ill try to get this on video sometime to share it.
Keeping true to the form itself is the most difficult part, I agree. So far I have had little success with mixing the yo-yo with the Taiji. Its just too sweeping and I have trouble keeping the yo-yo from tumbling. I may fall back on my Kempo roots and go simple to start. I would love to see what you’ve done so far! What are you throwing?
I gave it a go yesterday and I could find stances that definitely not only work but also help, I’ll look further into it then report back
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