Taking the yoyo off the string has never been judged in 1A competition, I believe the reverse of that(Mobius), was an oversight they have rectified.
Like I said before. It is not innovation if you deviate from the RULES. You’re just doing something different at that point.
Which is all well and good, but it doesn’t fit within the rules of the division so it doesn’t count. That simple.
Rules change, this one affects, um, two people? Tough.
Also, he can still get up and play on stage. Nobody said he would be disqualified, or they’d kick him off the stage right there. His Mobius tricks just wont get scored, because it isn’t 1A.
I don’t see any Mobius players winning contests anyway, so, this isn’t a big deal.
I agree with Mikers, if not in the way he is arguing it.
I believe 1A should stay strictly as a yoyo attached to the string, attached to your finger. Variations in that rule (4A, 5A) is not scored, so I don’t think Mobius should be also.
Mikers is saying Chopsticks still agrees to the “yoyo attached to string, attached to finger” rule, so it is scored. Anything that goes against the rule isn’t scored.
Mikers, have you ever watched Zammy or Doc Pop play Moebius? There’s definitely a difference between 5A and Moebius. I think Moebius closely enough resembles 1A that people shouldn’t be forced to move to AP for playing it. And I don’t think that any advancements made in 1A should have to be looked at and said “Nah. They need to go to the AP or Open Series”.
I understand exactly where you’re coming from, but don’t find myself agreeing with it. I feel like this is an issue that you fall on one side of the fence or the other. Which is why I made this thread. I’m here for discussion, and, if people are so inclined, action to change.
You do have some good points on the state of innovation in yoyoing, and don’t let that be discounted. I tend to be on hiatus more and each time I come back I see huge strides. And John Ando is a fair point. My argument here is that by saying “Eh. You’re variation of yoyoing doesn’t really count here.” You’re taking a lot of innovation and throwing it out the window. Because a lot of people, myself included, won’t see a point in competing at the highest levels with that newest innovation. What (In my opinion) is the pinnacle of our hobby should be about showcasing the highlight reel of our hobby. The innovations, the new technologies. You shouldn’t be relegated to other divisions on technicalities.
ok I do agree that Mobius is not “1A” But since there isn’t a Mobius division I think Mobius players should be allowed to compete in the 1A division because they have no other division to compete in.
Yes I heard that you mentioned they could just do open but there are some contests that don’t have an Open division some contests have seperate divisions for 1A 2A 3A 4A 5A and mobius isn’t the same as 2A so obviously they can’t compete in thaqt division same with the other styles. So since mobius is closer to1A than anything else I think they should still be allowed to compete in the 1A division even though Mobius isn’t e4xactly “1A” its relativly close.
And Mickers Dude chill out everytime you come into a thread it starts a flame war and the thread gets locked. I’m not saying I don’t like you your a senior member of the community and you have insight and knowledge that I may never have but do you have to turn everything into a flame war?
I throw 1A with a counterweight in my hand. I don’t expect too be included in either 1A or 5A division, because I do neither. Seems fine, they seem to be trying to push the sport into a, sport rather then some artistic competition. Don’t like it don’t go, don’t compete, and make sure they know the rules changes are the reason. In life you can’t control others but you sure as hell can control yourself.
This is a terrible rule change. Why get rid of it? Honestly, this makes no sense. This isn’t a matter of innovation or jipping the few moebius players of all points, it is a matter of common sense. Seriously, what’s the big idea?
Paul Kerbel used a moebius style in his worlds routine last(?) year. All this did was add a really nice variation to his freestyle; it added a particular freshness which otherwise would not have been present. All moebius really is is a way to add some variation to your freestyle, and it’s really nothing more than that. You aren’t racking in the tech points if you do moebius.
This entire discussion begs the question: Will moebius be scored in the 5A division?
Schnayke: What if you want to compete? Like realllllyyy want to?
1A hasn’t been defined as the string being attached to both the yoyo and the finger in the past. For example, the 2014 Worlds rules don’t define it that way:
I don’t think it’s just an oversight that the rules allowed moebius for 1A either, since people occasionally did it and previous organizers and judges were well aware of that and still didn’t change it.
Taking the yoyo off the string and freehand/counterweight play did used to be scored as part of 1A–for example Steve Brown winning BAC in 1999 and 2001 playing freehand or Hironori Mii taking 2nd at Worlds 1999 playing offstring. They stopped scoring those tricks for 1A once they got their own division(s) and those tricks fell under the realm of a separate contest division, but until then they were considered part of 1A competition.
I don’t think it is necessarily that big a deal to exclude moebius from 1A at Worlds since it hasn’t really caught on and hardly anyone does it anyway, at least at Worlds, but I also don’t think Moebius is antithetical to how 1A has always been defined in the past.
Quick question, has anyone asked why they stopped counting points for Mobius because someone should. Also, if Zammy already accepted the fact that they stopped scoring for Mobius the why can’t the people who do not compete accept the fact?
that really stinks that they will not be scoring it. However, maybe they are trying to figure out how to score it correctly, but until then it will remain with no score to not make the competition unfair.
It’s quite stupid. It works-- at least a little bit-- already, so why just get rid of it while they try to fix it?
Obviously this is all speculation. I want someone who is in the know to tell us what’s up. Although, I can imagine that it’ll just be some B.S. like “we think that moebius is dead, so therefor we discontinued it from the competition world.” Just keep it around, darnit.
I’ve only compete once so I’m not sure about the way the rulings work. Do the rules of the world yoyo contest affect the rules of state?
I ask because I see it being a problem for moebius players not being able to compete with their style in 1A and having no option because of a lack of an Open division on a state competition level, similar to what Erik said, but on the world level I think Moebius players having to compete in open division isn’t such a bad thing.
If you want to compete on the 1A arena at a world level I’m sure everyone up there has adjusted their style of play and there is solid reasons to keeping moebius out of 1A. They now want it to just be the yoyo attached to the string and the string attached to the yoyo.
Solid points have been made but I think if there is an available open division moebius players have a place to go and if it’s not available then 1A would seem like a fair place.
I see that this could be inconsistent and cause problems but that’s why I’m not making the rules and I’ll be interested to see if this get addressed by someone who does.