That message is clear, and joyous. Brian and Catherine are wonderful players and the video is fun. It is the unintended message that bothers me, and really the yo yo imperial challenge is what gives me the heebeegeebees.
I pick on Duncan and Spintastics because they are the only companies making entry level tops, and so much product frustration could be eliminated for new players, who could instead just focus on learning a skill that is entirely frustrating enough on its own. All tops have shortcomings to some degree, even S8 tops. In an effort to prove my objectiveness, here they are:
The machined finish on the delrin makes it extra slick, which makes it extra-un-forgiving if your throw is anything less than perfect. This can make it very difficult to learn to throw on. If it had a polished finish, it would be better, but polished finishes are sticky on the fingers and make tricks like bigscoop extra hard. Trade offs. All the time with the trade offs.
The stock S8 string is high quality, and extra long, but for a top like the Giulia, the size and weight distribution really call for a thicker string. When string is thin, you have to throw it soft at first with lots of pull back at the end but that is hard to grasp for beginners.
Recently we found that the machinist made a grievous change on the STB 2.0, making it fragile at the seam, not unlike like the cheap tops. Sucks to have to tape an $85 top. Still the best playing top in the world IMO.
I never really understood the design intent of the Sofia.
(note to admin: this thread should probably be renamed or split from the Blizzard thread).
It is heart warming Kevin that you are so faithful to Duncan. Lot’s of love there I also love what Duncan did for tops around 2000. If was very important. They just have not kept it up.
For what it may be worth, I play fixed tip with Spintastics metal tops and play (much less) bearing tip with S8 tops.
well, i do like the tops, but the reason i jump to the defense of Duncan so fast is i believe the on going criticism doesn’t change anything except to put off someone on the fence about getting a top from going ahead and getting a top.
it also seems unfair because i have experienced all of the same kinds of problems attributed to the Duncan tops with a variety of other manufacturers. why do they get a pass, but Duncan is responsible for ruining generations of would be players??
for learning the basic tricks, and having fun with tops, the RK and BK are fine to start with. i would rather devote my energies to encouraging new players to try throwing tops than focusing on all the little road blocks.
(note to admin: if you do split this thread, you might consider calling it,
Duncan Storm series, Great Tops, or Greatest Tops Ever?)
just kidding, i don’t think you should split the thread, it’s all pertinent.
Words of wisdom here! Many are rocking the cheap plastics and doing insanely good tricks and combos with the lesser expensive models.
I got my first top not to long ago and wow it’s kicking my butt. But I say once you get your top keep practicing and you’ll pick it up and remember ask for help of you need it instead of putting it down and missing out.
Spin tops are much harder to pick up then anything else I’ve done but man that one time when I got it to flop on its tip and spin wildly and then crash out was so exciting and filled me with hope I could rock I and get a perfect landing at some point.
Have fun and I look forward to hearing how your adventure goes!
I’d be glad to do that, but I’m having a really hard time findin a solid place to learn more about tops and how to make them do their thing. I watched Duncan’s how to be a player and honestly I didn’t walk away from it knowing how to do any more tricks or understand much more about my top. However I did laugh a lot and find Steve and the gang really did some fun stuff in the video and their tricks and fun inspire me to keep trying.
I’m just so lost at this point. Is there a spin top forum out there or sights that offer lots of help? (I cannot seem to find the videos you made yophosis as Kevin had sent them to me a long long while ago but I’ve since lost those PMs.
The reason I complain about Duncan is not that their tops have problems. As you said other brands also had problems with their products. The problem is that Duncan has been deaf to any suggestions or advice. Not even when the advice came directly from their own team players (Takeshi or Mark Hayward.) Not even when it was as easy as changing the length of the string. On the other hand, Dale Oliver replaced the metal cap for a plastic cap on the QS, took out the side grooves on the new HP replacement (Hornet) and started giving the option of diabolo tips (for example); all because of player’s feedback. Of course, Duncan did better than YYJ that quit making tops . . .
If I may say so, the most active and comprehensive forum about tops is at www.iTopSpin.com which is part of my site (www.ta0.com). It may be a little overwhelming as it covers all aspects of top spinning, such as top turning, top collecting, different types of spinning top play from around the world, etc. Don’t be shy because the best players post there or the ones with most years of experience. I think the forum is very welcoming to newbies and we try to be as helpful as we can. But the feel is probably different to the typical yo-yo board (in part because the average age of the posters).
It is heart warming ta0, the animosity you have for this toy manufacturer. That is to say, it gives me heart burn reading these posts.
Your top site is a good forum for a vast range of all things spin top, and while it may be welcoming to newbies, it is not IMO as welcoming to opinions on things that differ much from you own.
Anyways, I forgot the question… oh yeah, blizzards…Swell tops,
One of the interviews on the documentary “Heritage - The Duncan Yo-Yo Story” was filmed in my house. When the Duncan tour stopped short of coming to San Antonio, I drove to San Marcos to meet them. I have an online museum of Duncan tops. I don’t have any animosity against Duncan (or any brand) just some disappointment.
I have been accused of policing the forum too much (to avoid flame wars and such) and I do have opinions about many things. So I could be guilty of giving that impression, I guess. :-\
I’ve been throwing the Bliz and can land spinners easily enough but it always lands lopsided (might be my throw) and when I scoop it or rocket into hand it will spin fine for a sec then shutter and and become unstable. When I pulled it apart this afternoon I noticed there was some extra plastic under the second S in spintastics with nothing to balance it on the other side.
Could this extra plastic be the cause of my problems?
I’m not sure if you are describing a bearing that is grabbing a little, or the natural precession that you have to correct for when the spin becomes unstable. It can come on pretty fast when you are getting used to handling the top (like a shutter) and then if you don’t correct it, the top flops over and you lose control of it.
Have you seen this?
[url=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wgyXnfTWFTU_Ey0&feature=youtu.be]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wgyXnfTWFTU_Ey0&feature=youtu.be]
If the top is doing that because it is not balanced, it should be doing it before you pick it up. Sometimes when a bearing is borderline (grabby) the act of lifting it up unloads the pressure on the tip, and it starts to grab when it gets to your hand. Are you feeling the tip spin when it starts to shudder? If it is the bearing grabbing, the tip will be spinning with the top instead of staying stationary on your palm.
I think this is intentional asymmetry intended to balance what was thought to be a predictable production problem. In other words, I think they did a run, tested where the most common spot where weight was needed to balance the top and then added extra plastic there in production. In the old Blizzards, there used to be a hole through the cap in one side, assuming to be for the same reason but a void on the opposite side instead.
It sounds like you got one that is extremely out of balance. No worries, you can fix it. Do this:
When you pinch the tip with your fingers and spin it with the other hand, does the bearing spin smoothly?
no it doesn’t it wobbles in a pattern akin to a pencil in a spiralgraph and it’s more pronounced as it slows down. The problem dissipates when I pop the top off.
The question I have is why is it spinning okay for a second or so and then going out of control? If it is seriously out of balance, it should always feel that way.
That is making me wonder if it is the bearing or perhaps your technique. When you caught the boomerang, did it seem more stable
(spinning faster than it would be after scooping it up off the floor)?
So I took the top apart to clean the bearings, incase that was the issue, and noticed that there is no bearing well for the inside bearing. This seems to let the inside bearing slip around inside some, moving the tip.
When putting it back together I tightened the nut that holds it all together until it wouldn’t turn easily which effectively locked the tip making it a fixed tip. I played with that for a bit and it plays wonderfully as a fixed tip. The shimming shake was gone and the top behaved itself. I think I’m going to leave it locked down for now.
Before you tightened it down, was there a lot of play in the tip? Like, could you wiggle it around and stuff? If so, that would explain the erratic behavior. Nothing can move on a top or it will be crazy. I need to ask Dale to send me a Blizzard and see what’s up.
I also love what Duncan did for tops around 2000. If was very important. They just have not kept it up.