Geezer, you always seem to forget that Chinese labor is about 1/4 - 1/5 what it is here in the states. Lets do a quick run of numbers
Machining
USA - ~$16
China - ~$4
Anodizing
USA splash - ~$15 (Probably about what it is if you are anodizing a bunch)
China splash ~$4
USA solid color ~$8
China solid color $2
Axles are about $.07 a piece in the US when you buy packs of 100. If you need thousands you could probably buy them for $.04 a piece.
Bearings are similar. The same quality bearings MYY uses are probably about $4 a piece if you buy about 100 from a US dealer. You can probably get the same bearings in China for about $1.
Lets run the numbers. We’ll assume packaging is $1.50: (This does not include a beadblasted, splashed finish)
US small run manufacturer
16 + 8 + .07 + 4 + 1.50 = 29.57 (A splashed beadblasted yoyo would run more like $45)
Chinese mass producer
4 + 2 + .04 + 1 + 1.50 = 8.90
Double the numbers for the wholesale price (Again, just a rough estimate), then multiply them by 1.15 for the estimated markup of a reseller.
US
Solid Unblasted (Not as realistic a figure) - 68.01
Splash Blasted (More realistic) - 103.5
I love it how some people see a good quality yoyo for 20$ and instantly assume the brand selling them for that is somehow doing something evil, itjust can’t possibly be other brands put a huge markup. It’s just like iphones. You can buy the same hardware with an android for half a price, but you just can’t make the fanboys understand that. It must be googlethat’s evil and trying to ruin apple rather than apple charging a lot more just because.
Geezer, myy are primarily made for the asian market. You know, where there are more kids demographically, but the average income is just like… 5 times the amount of a 100$ throw? Selling yoyos for large sums isn’t really possible in that market, so they produce them for really cheap using techniques such as buying a whole year’s supply of aluminum just for discounts, buying their own machines and paint, etc. they then ship to u.s. stores via containers on a ship which is really slow but really cheap, and that’s about it. The secret is in volume. Did you know that 90% of the world’s zippers are made by one company? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/YKK_Group . That’s how they make a profit, and this system is actually working for them really well http://www.guardian.co.uk/business/2012/nov/09/china-overtake-us-four-years-oecd .
The difference is that for ultra large companies, such as yyf, yyj, duncan, the strategy is long term so they don’t need to recover all their money as soon as they build a factory(so they build it), whereas small manufacturers need to recover their money immediately, so they have to resort to services which also have a markup, so in the end proffit is smaller in terms of % of the retail price for a smaller company.
Ok, Dif-e-Yo did not come up with the kk bearing, bearings have been made grooved since before bearings were even put into yoyos. The hub stack idea was not thought of by YYF, they just innovated on it, Magic Yoyo, Aoda, and Auldey basically improved and got around the patent by using a B sized bearing instead of an A. As for why are the prices so low? The main answer is cheaper labor. Why did YYF, Apple, and any other large company start manufacturing their stuff in China? Answer: You guessed it, CHEAPER LABOR. That’s why Magic Yoyo is able to sell their yoyos for 20$ each, and don’t forget they also use cheaper materials, and recycle their aluminum. They melt down the scraps into a new bar stock. Manufacturers in the US also do that, but they use it to create other stuff. The Superwide is basically an Aoda Miracle with different engravings and anodize, the same with the YYF JK. Why is the Superwide 3x the price of the Miracle? Partly is because YYF tests them, throws out the ones that don’t make qualifications, strip them, anodize them, and then engrave them. To do this in a mass run, it maybe only costs an extra 10$ per yoyo. So why? It’s to make a larger profit. The metal isn’t changed at all, Ben admitted it to be the same aluminum they use in Coke cans. Think about it for a bit.
So far I’ve bought every yoyo-related thing I own from YYE, except for a few Brain yoyos I could find locally. I’m all about supporting businesses you love and people who do good business. On the other hand, nothing saying that they’re mutually exclusive:
I might want a T5 (in fact, I do). I’m also getting keen on a few of the yoyos I can get on YYE. Let’s say a new SPYY Addiction for example. The $15 I’d spend on the T5 isn’t actually replacing my desire for an Addiction. So it really just boils down to: “Buy a T5 and an Addiction, or JUST buy the Addiction”. Either way, YYE only sees my money spent on the Addiction. If YYE stocked T5’s, I guess they’d see the money from both.
A different counter-example: I like to support YYE, but I also like to support the companies that sell through here. For example, Twisted Stringz, Toxic, and Yoyo String Lab all make excellent strings that I love, even though they’re pricier than bulk poly or Kitty string. So, I buy a 50-pack of bulk poly, and on the same order, I decide I want to throw some Type X. Bulk poly has a place in my arsenal, even though it’s not as good as Type X. Am I doing something evil or kicking smaller companies by buying the bulk poly? I don’t see anyone complaining about buying cheap Chinese-made in any string recommendation threads…
Not trying to draw conclusions or make recommendations (hey, it’s not my company!) just putting another perspective out there.
Not sure what geezer was trying to get across with his post. He just seems angry at the Chinese. All I know is if the n12 performs well I will be happy. The first time I saw the magic yoyo brand I thought these yoyos must be a joke, but after reading what some people have said I decided to give one a try. To me I have nothing to lose and its unfortunate they don’t acknowledge US patents but I won’t lose any sleep over it like this guy.
GregP, I seriously love reading every post you make. You are my favorite user on this site.
For that reason, I just so happen to have a T5 laying around. It has a couple love dings, but it is tried and true.
Since I got my N12, well… my T5 has been just sitting in the case, cuz I can’t sell a dinged T5… the value is about as much as a pack of gum. But it is still smooth. (I’m making it sound way worse than it is, it’s still smooth, etc).
Do you want the T5? I’ll give it to you for free. PM me your address, I’m going to the post office tomorrow anyway.
Also, I agree 100% with your “buying a T5 doesn’t replace my desire for an Addiction”. That’s such a great point. And it’s also sad because US stores that do stock MYY, they sometimes double the cost, and they still sell out.
Also, I always order from YYE when they have what I want, especially accessories. I’l always throw in some mod spacers, bearings, response stickers, I always buy a bundle of string, there’s just little things you always top off your order with. I basically try to make my order worth the shipping. I feel if he had MYY’s, people wouldn’t just be “Ordering a T5”… they would be tossing T5’s in their cart just to top off their order.
Like, I ordered a Barracuda and a bundle, if there were N12’s on this site, I would have thrown one of those in the cart as well and called it a day. Just the N12 alone could have put $10 profit into Andre’s pocket. (Given he marks them up an extra $10+). And that’s MONEY. Do that all day long, kick your feet up and watch the money flow in.
I think people don’t like MYY, for the same reasons people hate supermarket brand cereals. If I go to Wal-Mart (or an equivalent), and they are selling Fruit Loops for five bucks a box, and Fruity O’s for two bucks, people are still going to buy Fruit Loops, because they are “genuine” cereal, despite it all tasting the same. People judge value that way, calling it a “knock-off” brand of cereal, even if it is actually a true to heart original creation.
It all really boils down to what OTHER people think. CLYW is a great company, but do you think that they would sell so many yoyos so quickly if it wasn’t surrounded by hype (which it deserves don’t get me wrong). God Tricks makes GREAT throws, for pretty cheap too! But no one ever talks about them because no one knows them, or think they’re awful since it’s a Chinese company (excuse the generalization). I’m personally fascinated by cheaper throws, I mean I get how you can make a metal yoyo that’ll sleep forever, and land any trick you’ve ever wanted for a 150 bucks, but can you do it in less than 30? MYY has done that.
You make a good point, but MYY really isn’t that generic either. Granted, their splashes lack creativity and originality, but nothing I’ve seen as of late is a copy. Another thing to bring up at this point is: What if MYY is your only affordable option to a metal alloy throw? Does that make you a consumer criminal? If you start off low, what are your chances of dropping a couple hundred further on down the road?
Just something to think about. I understand both sides to the situation, but I just wish arguments like this wouldn’t keep recurring.
The t5 + addiction part really hit me too. Buying a MYY doesn’t really stops one’s wants. I still want other things say Summit, M10, an Ava and more. On my path to buying a trident, and will probably be buying other jojos too.
Also, same with you, I play with my t5 waaaaay more than my other throws. Also its dinged up already and still pretty smooth. At this performance I’m really impressed. I was actually thinking something along the lines of ‘Doesn’t the t5 use some lower quality aluminum? Why is still this good?’
Yeah, I’ve been walking the dog with mine atleast 20 times a day I’ve thrown it straight down into the concrete, I’m abusing it very bad and it’s still smooth.
People are tripping. Also, I’ve violently been screwing and unscrewing it. It still prevails
Meh, Magic Yoyos. Dropped one while it wasn’t even spinning onto the concrete and it dinged real bad. The anno is soft and not at all durable and the aluminum its made with is also super weak.
I would rather buy a yoyo from a company like Square Wheels than Magic Yoyos because then I would be supporting: A) My country (this doesn’t apply to everyone on this thread)
B) A good yoyo company
C) A small business, which I like to support.
Dont want people to quote this and be like “gosh dumbo, I think my T283773748 plays good so shut the blip up.”
If paying an extra $80 is what it takes to get a yoyo that plays a little better, supports small yoyo businesses, and is higher quality than a Magic Yoyo, than I’ll do it. And quite frankly, that’s what tons of people do. If they didn’t, CLYW, OneDrop, SPYY and other companies like that would be out of business.
I directly syphon tens of thousands of dollars of my income to this country. We are talking half my income. please don’t act like $13 voids all my support for this country.
Also, I’ll take a video of me with a “low quality” t5. Ill unscrew it, take one half and drop it from about my waist (I’m 6’3), then I’ll take the other half and spike it on the ground like a football. I’m guessing the damage wont be any more abysmal than a “high quality” throw
I actually did find that the MYY yo-yos did have a softer body to them, but playing a T6 was still a really fun experience, and it was great for freehand play.
there is no beating something like a OD or a SPYY, though.
They did use softer aluminum but the n12 is 6061 and is $14 atm. Same quality aluminum as most $100+ throws
The t5 is softer, but it’s not that far off from 6061.
Also, yes, i have expensive throws. most of us do. I choose not to put my equipment before my skills… But i guess i can understand… But not really considering the t5 doesn’t limit me in any way except maybe… Grinds?.
If YYE stocked T5’s, I guess they’d see the money from both.