# Ti Walkers might come back if Heath gets 200 likes on this link. **URL:** \ **Category:** General Yo-Yo\ **Created:** [August 8, 2012, 4:10pm UTC](https://forums.yoyoexpert.com/t/ti-walkers-might-come-back-if-heath-gets-200-likes-on-this-link/41226 "2012-08-08T16:10:35Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![anonyo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/8baadc/32.png) [@anonyo](https://forums.yoyoexpert.com/u/anonyo)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2012, 11:19pm UTC](https://forums.yoyoexpert.com/t/ti-walkers-might-come-back-if-heath-gets-200-likes-on-this-link/41226/21 "2012-08-08T23:19:53Z")
> [@HVizier](#): > > lol no waffling, we call it crawfishing down here in Louisiana > > please refer to Jason Wongs answer as to why companies take care of collectors > > i think i will make the Grievous soon, then a Ti version of it No, call it the Gladiator, not the Greivous. That way you can call the Titanium version the Ti-Fighter. Sorry, just had to say it. ---
**Author:** ![yoyoavenger](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex015/user_avatar/forums.yoyoexpert.com/yoyoavenger/32/884_2.png) [@yoyoavenger](https://forums.yoyoexpert.com/u/yoyoavenger)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2012, 11:28pm UTC](https://forums.yoyoexpert.com/t/ti-walkers-might-come-back-if-heath-gets-200-likes-on-this-link/41226/22 "2012-08-08T23:28:24Z")
I like Studios idea. Star Wars themes Ti Yoyos=awesome ---
**Author:** ![vegabomb](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex015/user_avatar/forums.yoyoexpert.com/vegabomb/32/199_2.png) [@vegabomb](https://forums.yoyoexpert.com/u/vegabomb)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2012, 11:52pm UTC](https://forums.yoyoexpert.com/t/ti-walkers-might-come-back-if-heath-gets-200-likes-on-this-link/41226/23 "2012-08-08T23:52:18Z")
Ti-Phiter was a titanium yo-yo made by Kyo a few years back. ---
**Author:** ![moefv](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex015/user_avatar/forums.yoyoexpert.com/moefv/32/106762_2.png) [@moefv](https://forums.yoyoexpert.com/u/moefv)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2012, 12:24am UTC](https://forums.yoyoexpert.com/t/ti-walkers-might-come-back-if-heath-gets-200-likes-on-this-link/41226/24 "2012-08-09T00:24:20Z")
The yoyo that I was always interested in was the ELF-KUMO! It is also VsNewton’s rarest yoyo! God Bless - Moefv ---
**Author:** ![yoyodoc](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex015/user_avatar/forums.yoyoexpert.com/yoyodoc/32/48820_2.png) [@yoyodoc](https://forums.yoyoexpert.com/u/yoyodoc)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2012, 12:27am UTC](https://forums.yoyoexpert.com/t/ti-walkers-might-come-back-if-heath-gets-200-likes-on-this-link/41226/25 "2012-08-09T00:27:49Z")
Ya wanna see pics? ---
**Author:** ![jasonwongzero](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex015/user_avatar/forums.yoyoexpert.com/jasonwongzero/32/725_2.png) [@jasonwongzero](https://forums.yoyoexpert.com/u/jasonwongzero)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2012, 7:08am UTC](https://forums.yoyoexpert.com/t/ti-walkers-might-come-back-if-heath-gets-200-likes-on-this-link/41226/26 "2012-08-09T07:08:49Z")
> [@YoyoGeezer](#): > > As I underrstand it - you will not make any more Ti Walkers because you said you would not. Because of this, some “collector” believes that if you make any more you have: > > 1. Broken a sacred promise to the yoyo gods. No, he will have broken a promise he made to the yoyo community. To me, this is the number one reason why he should not make more Ti-Walkers. Heath realizes this as well which is why he calls it out as the number one most important reason he shouldn’t make more in his original post. > [@](#): > > 1. Somehow undermined the percieved “value” of a yoyo that they do not play and will not sell. Increasing the number of yoyos available, decreases its rarity and thus its value. This is undisputable. > [@](#): > > I believe that the significant increase in the population of yoyo consumers has made previous comittments irrelavant as well as unfair. This should be the only rational needed to justify making more. Protestations to the contrary are only trying to limit supply for selfish reasons only. I personally find this comment troubling… what you’re saying is that the market justifies breaking old commitments. If this were the case, why should companies honor any promises at all? For example, take product warranties… It’s much cheaper to sell products with a ‘warranty’ and then never follow through with warranty claims when a customer comes asking for support. Would you not find this problematic? ---
**Author:** ![anonyo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/8baadc/32.png) [@anonyo](https://forums.yoyoexpert.com/u/anonyo)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2012, 7:54am UTC](https://forums.yoyoexpert.com/t/ti-walkers-might-come-back-if-heath-gets-200-likes-on-this-link/41226/27 "2012-08-09T07:54:31Z")
New players come in all the time. Players leave, exit and otherwise leave the scene all the time. I entered this thing in May of 2011. Whatever I missed, well hey, my problem. I can’t expect a yoyo manufacturer to re-issue stuff to suit me and other new users. If we missed the wave and releases, that’s OUR problem. How do we "noobs’ fix this? We hit the BST and other retailers and see what we can scrounge up, if we’re lucky enough to do so. Will I ever get a Ti-Walker? Who knows. I’m a bit let down Heath isn’t going to re-release these. At the same time, I’ll accept and respect his decision. It also won’t change my positive impression of his company as I’m super happy with my Sky Walker. BST is just a few clicks away and patience can be rewarded. ---
**Author:** ![YoyoGeezer](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex015/user_avatar/forums.yoyoexpert.com/yoyogeezer/32/755_2.png) [@YoyoGeezer](https://forums.yoyoexpert.com/u/YoyoGeezer)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2012, 10:19pm UTC](https://forums.yoyoexpert.com/t/ti-walkers-might-come-back-if-heath-gets-200-likes-on-this-link/41226/28 "2012-08-09T22:19:08Z")
Seen many Ti Walker’s for sale recently? Sorry, you can’t have one. Collectors will be angry if more are made available. I mean really - Heath PROMISED! Sounds totally logical - right? ---
**Author:** ![jasonwongzero](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex015/user_avatar/forums.yoyoexpert.com/jasonwongzero/32/725_2.png) [@jasonwongzero](https://forums.yoyoexpert.com/u/jasonwongzero)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2012, 10:49pm UTC](https://forums.yoyoexpert.com/t/ti-walkers-might-come-back-if-heath-gets-200-likes-on-this-link/41226/29 "2012-08-09T22:49:31Z")
I really don’t mean any offense by this… (I am just trying to understand your perspective), but it seems you have very different perspectives on the morale value of keeping promises, standing behind one’s word, maintaining good corporate values, etc. I appreciate that America tends to be a laissaz-faire, buyer beware, market driven, capitalist economy, but even the most die-hard capitalists would argue that going back on one’s word or breaking agreements (verbal or written) does not contribute positively to 1) a company’s corporate image (and thus, long term profits) or 2) the greater benefit of an efficiently run marketplace. I can recreate pretty much any of the first run anodize colorways for rare CLYWs like the 28s Peaks. But I make it a policy not to do this, because I respect the limited nature of those colorways and I don’t think it’s right for me to be messing with CLYW’s limited run totals. Also… why do you feel entitled to access to products which have already been produced and retired? Should Magic the Gathering/Pokemon reprint a bunch of old, valuable, retired cards because yourself and others didn’t get a chance to buy them? You missed the TiWalker release, I’m sorry about that, but that’s frankly no one’s fault… least of all the yoyo buyers who worked extra, saved money, stayed up late by their computers and in the end supported VsNYYC during that product’s launch. As I mentioned in the beginning of my response, I’m not trying to argue and I mean no offense, I am just really having a very difficult time following your logic. Jason ---
**Author:** ![Deeman103](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b5e925/32.png) [@Deeman103](https://forums.yoyoexpert.com/u/Deeman103)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2012, 11:02pm UTC](https://forums.yoyoexpert.com/t/ti-walkers-might-come-back-if-heath-gets-200-likes-on-this-link/41226/30 "2012-08-09T23:02:51Z")
^ Oh snap ---
**Author:** ![NathanC](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex015/user_avatar/forums.yoyoexpert.com/nathanc/32/891_2.png) [@NathanC](https://forums.yoyoexpert.com/u/NathanC)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2012, 11:47pm UTC](https://forums.yoyoexpert.com/t/ti-walkers-might-come-back-if-heath-gets-200-likes-on-this-link/41226/31 "2012-08-09T23:47:22Z")
Ti Walker has been surpassed by newer Ti throws anyway imo. Ti5 \>\>\>\> Ti Walker. ---
**Author:** ![HVizier](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex015/user_avatar/forums.yoyoexpert.com/hvizier/32/48785_2.png) [@HVizier](https://forums.yoyoexpert.com/u/HVizier)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2012, 7:14am UTC](https://forums.yoyoexpert.com/t/ti-walkers-might-come-back-if-heath-gets-200-likes-on-this-link/41226/32 "2012-08-10T07:14:30Z")
meh, Landon and I swapped @ WYYC. we ended up really digging both of them from both sides and agreed that it was a “tie” (pun completely intended) ---
**Author:** ![WretchedRapture](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex015/user_avatar/forums.yoyoexpert.com/wretchedrapture/32/1124_2.png) [@WretchedRapture](https://forums.yoyoexpert.com/u/WretchedRapture)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2012, 7:33am UTC](https://forums.yoyoexpert.com/t/ti-walkers-might-come-back-if-heath-gets-200-likes-on-this-link/41226/33 "2012-08-10T07:33:26Z")
> [@Deeman103](#): > > ^ > Oh snap ^ Double snap and a Head Roll. ---
**Author:** ![YoyoGeezer](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex015/user_avatar/forums.yoyoexpert.com/yoyogeezer/32/755_2.png) [@YoyoGeezer](https://forums.yoyoexpert.com/u/YoyoGeezer)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2012, 12:28am UTC](https://forums.yoyoexpert.com/t/ti-walkers-might-come-back-if-heath-gets-200-likes-on-this-link/41226/34 "2012-08-11T00:28:50Z")
> [@jasonwongzero](#): > > As I mentioned in the beginning of my response, I’m not trying to argue and I mean no offense, I am just really having a very difficult time following your logic. Jason, there is certainly no offence taken to your thoughtful posting. Your opinions are respected and appreciated. I also respect that your view of the importance of these custom yoyos is different than mine for good reason. You are an artist with yoyos who creates value that is determined by this “collector” market. Hey, I am one of them. I only wish you would do more 🙂 I also do want to make one thing clear - I did not miss out on the Ti Walker. I was sitting at my computer with my finger ready and managed to secure on of those coveted throws just like the rest (You actually anodized it - along with my Sovereign a few months back!); so my opinion is not motivated by want. My opinion is motivated by the FACT that this is one of the best throws ever made and there are hundreds of people that would gladly pay alot more than $200 to have one. What right do previous collector’s have to deny new-consumers the equipment that they themselves enjoy so much? Your position on this “Promise” thing is laudable; if we were talking about a commitment to pay for your son’s college; or a promise to another never to divulge a secret. But we are talking about yoyo’s right? These are not numbered lithographs that have no value other than perceived scarcity - they are probably one of the best yoyos ever made and therefore has utility that is far greater than some “collector” value. I see no inherent honor in limiting yoyo availability to enhance value. Is VSYC in the BUSINESS of ensuring limited quantities of yoyos? I think they are in business to make yoyos and money. If this is not the case, then my comments are way off. But if it is the case that they are in business to make yoyos and money - what additional responsibility does VSNYC have towards the Ti Walker Consumer beyond providing a good for a service? And really, if Heath made this PROMISE that was a sacred bond to the consumer - then why does this thread even exist? Obviously VSNYC does not, or did not, share your elevated view of the importance of this vow. ---
**Author:** ![jasonwongzero](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex015/user_avatar/forums.yoyoexpert.com/jasonwongzero/32/725_2.png) [@jasonwongzero](https://forums.yoyoexpert.com/u/jasonwongzero)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2012, 12:56am UTC](https://forums.yoyoexpert.com/t/ti-walkers-might-come-back-if-heath-gets-200-likes-on-this-link/41226/35 "2012-08-11T00:56:40Z")
Mutual respect and thoughtful discussion. Thanks YoYoGeezer, this is a refreshing thread! 🙂 IMHO, this thread exists because Heath tends to have a very engaged relationship with the yoyo community. He involves the community in his product planning. This thread is here because it’s him thinking out loud. I guess in the end, this boils down to how ‘serious’ one views the original promise. In my view, we are a very small hobby, a niche community really. We don’t have lots of contracts or formal agreements. There aren’t really any regulatory bodies. The majority of yoyo companies are really just one or two man shops. In this sort of community, I perceive one’s public statements, such as posts on YYE, YYN, Facebook, company websites, to be about as formal as it gets. To put it another way, you’re right, there’s no ‘legal’ reason why a TiWalker couldn’t be re-released. He wouldn’t be breaking any rules. The only reason not to re-release is a moral one and in the end I guess there is just room for interpretation here. In my humble opinion, a promise should be kept. Whether it’s small or large, verbalized or written. I am comfortable agreeing to disagree and I do think you bring up good points about accessibility to others. Thanks for the intelligent discussion. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![YoyoGeezer](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex015/user_avatar/forums.yoyoexpert.com/yoyogeezer/32/755_2.png) [@YoyoGeezer](https://forums.yoyoexpert.com/u/YoyoGeezer)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2012, 3:26am UTC](https://forums.yoyoexpert.com/t/ti-walkers-might-come-back-if-heath-gets-200-likes-on-this-link/41226/36 "2012-08-11T03:26:27Z")
I can certainly agree with that. Your point is understood a bit more by me due to your discussion on this thread. When I first read your comments, I disagreed much more than I do with you; now that I have come to know your reasoning on this issue. Thank you for sharing it with me. ---
**Author:** ![theTopo](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex015/user_avatar/forums.yoyoexpert.com/thetopo/32/1065_2.png) [@theTopo](https://forums.yoyoexpert.com/u/theTopo)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2012, 4:42am UTC](https://forums.yoyoexpert.com/t/ti-walkers-might-come-back-if-heath-gets-200-likes-on-this-link/41226/37 "2012-08-11T04:42:07Z")
I’d love to be able to buy a new run TiWalker but feel it’s more important to keep your word. Make an even better Ti throw and everyone should be happy. Also Heath, I’d suggest you never say never again when it comes to what VsNYYC will do in the future, and you won’t create any dilemmas like this for yourself again. ---
**Author:** ![Qozux](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/ee7513/32.png) [@Qozux](https://forums.yoyoexpert.com/u/Qozux)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2012, 5:32am UTC](https://forums.yoyoexpert.com/t/ti-walkers-might-come-back-if-heath-gets-200-likes-on-this-link/41226/38 "2012-08-11T05:32:47Z")
A man’s word is his own value. I respect ethics coming before business and profit. We all know he would sell out in minutes if the Ti Walker was re-released, but then what? Why would we trust him the next time when he said a run was limited? Thank you for not doing a second run. I’m happy to know I’ll never own a Ti Walker if that means there are more people in this world keeping their word. ---
**Author:** ![HVizier](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex015/user_avatar/forums.yoyoexpert.com/hvizier/32/48785_2.png) [@HVizier](https://forums.yoyoexpert.com/u/HVizier)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2012, 6:21am UTC](https://forums.yoyoexpert.com/t/ti-walkers-might-come-back-if-heath-gets-200-likes-on-this-link/41226/39 "2012-08-11T06:21:17Z")
even in the FB thread it was clearly stated as “testing the waters”. this is exactly why i come to the community when i have decisions like this to make. ---
**Author:** ![saintrobyn](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex015/user_avatar/forums.yoyoexpert.com/saintrobyn/32/54_2.png) [@saintrobyn](https://forums.yoyoexpert.com/u/saintrobyn)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2012, 6:26am UTC](https://forums.yoyoexpert.com/t/ti-walkers-might-come-back-if-heath-gets-200-likes-on-this-link/41226/40 "2012-08-11T06:26:51Z")
Jason, don’t worry too much about Geezer’s comments. He always seems to be the kvetching point of view on any topic… (I kid, I kid ;D ) That being said, He makes perfect sense, I actually agree with him. (See Geezer, I can be nice) There is a demand for them, Heath should give it some serious thought. All he would have to do is keep them laser etch free. This would mark a clear delineation between the collector’s series and the player’s series. If you think a second release would kill the value of the Ti-Walkers already in the market I will just point you at the One Drop Sovereign. The numbered ones still fetch quite a premium over the second release “common stock”. I see BST threads where people specifically ask for a numbered Sovereign, which boggles my mind because the only difference is the number on the yo-yo. If people were really in the know they would ask for one of the rare preproduction Sovs out there, they were 3 grams lighter. Back on topic, the collectors will still ask for numbered Ti-Walkers while the community will just ask for whatever is available, numbered or not. At the end of the day holding Heath to a promise that probably should not have been made is not fair to Vs. Newton. The release is pretty much guaranteed to sell out which would pump some much needed capital into the business and allow him to come up with some crazy new designs. Something we all want. As it stands companies need to ask themselves if it makes good business sense to cater to the collectors or to the players. [Previous page](https://forums.yoyoexpert.com/t/ti-walkers-might-come-back-if-heath-gets-200-likes-on-this-link/41226.md?page=1) [Next page](https://forums.yoyoexpert.com/t/ti-walkers-might-come-back-if-heath-gets-200-likes-on-this-link/41226.md?page=3)