# i think YoYo expert should sell magic yoyos. **URL:** \ **Category:** YoYoExpert Site Improvements\ **Created:** [December 30, 2012, 9:20pm UTC](https://forums.yoyoexpert.com/t/i-think-yoyo-expert-should-sell-magic-yoyos/47385 "2012-12-30T21:20:14Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Noonar](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex015/user_avatar/forums.yoyoexpert.com/noonar/32/1244_2.png) [@Noonar](https://forums.yoyoexpert.com/u/Noonar)\ **Post date:** [January 1, 2013, 7:02pm UTC](https://forums.yoyoexpert.com/t/i-think-yoyo-expert-should-sell-magic-yoyos/47385/21 "2013-01-01T19:02:03Z")
> [@DrAwesome](#): > > > [@Yonut](#): > > > > > [@DrAwesome](#): > > > > > > > [@tschneider](#): > > > > > > > > Again, even though they’re based in China, what I really meant is that they’re not an actual company. They manufacture yoyos yes, but do they really design their own yoyos? Maybe, but they aren’t innovative or new, it’s just cheap and plays decently. I think that if YYE were to stock them, it would take away from other companies that actually put time and effort into design and manufacturing. > > > > > > they have there own designs > > > > Having hubstacks on them is still patent infringement. > > hence my post before I was talking yoyo shape They get around the patent by using “B” size bearings in the hubstacks. They are smoother than yyf stacks actually ---
**Author:** ![Yonut](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/5f8ce5/32.png) [@Yonut](https://forums.yoyoexpert.com/u/Yonut)\ **Post date:** [January 2, 2013, 6:43pm UTC](https://forums.yoyoexpert.com/t/i-think-yoyo-expert-should-sell-magic-yoyos/47385/22 "2013-01-02T18:43:00Z")
> [@yoyospirit](#): > > Just because Magic Yoyos are based in China has nothing to do with why they aren’t being sold. YYF machines some yoyos in China, they are still being sold here. Also, Magic Yoyos have KK bearings and hubstacks does not infringe any kind of patent, those patents were made in the U.S, not in China. And only like, 3 of their yoyos actually are similar with a different yoyo, and those 3 aren’t even exactly alike. Selling them in the US does infringe on the patent, though. ---
**Author:** ![GregP](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex015/user_avatar/forums.yoyoexpert.com/gregp/32/1192_2.png) [@GregP](https://forums.yoyoexpert.com/u/GregP)\ **Post date:** [January 2, 2013, 8:38pm UTC](https://forums.yoyoexpert.com/t/i-think-yoyo-expert-should-sell-magic-yoyos/47385/23 "2013-01-02T20:38:25Z")
Patents are so tricky and silly. Perhaps their hubstacks circumvent the actual patent, and perhaps they don’t (have never inspected the patent document). Perhaps KonKave bearings’ patent is actually indefensible (the yoyo world did not invent bearings with a rounded indentation) or doesn’t exist (has anyone ever actually searched for their patent document?)… However… The buyer and distributor (YYE) still has the option to say, “I don’t care if strictly speaking it’s legal. I don’t like that YYF and Dif-e-Yo never get to see any money for their innovations.” So we could argue until we’re blue in the face about whether Magic YoYo is actually violating any patents and it wouldn’t matter if the buyer still isn’t interested in buying and distributing them. I would probably buy one or two if YYE stocked them, but there are other places to get them, and in the meantime I’m happy to order other stuff from YYE. ---
**Author:** ![yoyospirit](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex015/user_avatar/forums.yoyoexpert.com/yoyospirit/32/219875_2.png) [@yoyospirit](https://forums.yoyoexpert.com/u/yoyospirit)\ **Post date:** [January 2, 2013, 10:00pm UTC](https://forums.yoyoexpert.com/t/i-think-yoyo-expert-should-sell-magic-yoyos/47385/24 "2013-01-02T22:00:11Z")
> [@Yonut](#): > > > [@yoyospirit](#): > > > > Just because Magic Yoyos are based in China has nothing to do with why they aren’t being sold. YYF machines some yoyos in China, they are still being sold here. Also, Magic Yoyos have KK bearings and hubstacks does not infringe any kind of patent, those patents were made in the U.S, not in China. And only like, 3 of their yoyos actually are similar with a different yoyo, and those 3 aren’t even exactly alike. > > Selling them in the US does infringe on the patent, though. That’s why Magic Yoyo is based in China, and if a retailer is selling Magic Yoyos with hubstacks, Magic Yoyo can’t get in trouble for that, the retailer would for distributing the yoyos. ---
**Author:** ![jhb8426](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex015/user_avatar/forums.yoyoexpert.com/jhb8426/32/631_2.png) [@jhb8426](https://forums.yoyoexpert.com/u/jhb8426)\ **Post date:** [January 2, 2013, 10:15pm UTC](https://forums.yoyoexpert.com/t/i-think-yoyo-expert-should-sell-magic-yoyos/47385/25 "2013-01-02T22:15:47Z")
> [@GregP](#): > > The buyer and distributor (YYE) still has the option to say, “I don’t care if strictly speaking it’s legal. I don’t like that YYF and Dif-e-Yo never get to see any money for their innovations.” So we could argue until we’re blue in the face about whether (any company) is actually violating any patents and it wouldn’t matter if the buyer still isn’t interested in buying and distributing them. You hit it on the head totally. Legality issues aside, it’s an issue of principle for Andre. ---
**Author:** ![PlasticWhip](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex015/user_avatar/forums.yoyoexpert.com/plasticwhip/32/896_2.png) [@PlasticWhip](https://forums.yoyoexpert.com/u/PlasticWhip)\ **Post date:** [January 3, 2013, 11:50am UTC](https://forums.yoyoexpert.com/t/i-think-yoyo-expert-should-sell-magic-yoyos/47385/26 "2013-01-03T11:50:45Z")
> [@yoyospirit](#): > > Just because Magic Yoyos are based in China has nothing to do with why they aren’t being sold. YYF machines some yoyos in China, they are still being sold here. Also, Magic Yoyos have KK bearings and hubstacks does not infringe any kind of patent, those patents were made in the U.S, not in China. And only like, 3 of their yoyos actually are similar with a different yoyo, and those 3 aren’t even exactly alike. Amen. ---
**Author:** ![Y0Y0SR2PR0](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex015/user_avatar/forums.yoyoexpert.com/y0y0sr2pr0/32/1137_2.png) [@Y0Y0SR2PR0](https://forums.yoyoexpert.com/u/Y0Y0SR2PR0)\ **Post date:** [January 11, 2013, 4:48pm UTC](https://forums.yoyoexpert.com/t/i-think-yoyo-expert-should-sell-magic-yoyos/47385/27 "2013-01-11T16:48:13Z")
by adding magic yoyos to the site wouldn’t be a bad thing they make cheap metal throws that play like or near a 50-100 dollar throw and their designs are original(atleast of what i know) just my oppion might be wrong about originality but yoyos designs can have hints of each other -----edit----- you can replace the concave bearing and not stock hubstacked throws also takes the infringement out just inform buyers. ---
**Author:** ![anonyo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/8baadc/32.png) [@anonyo](https://forums.yoyoexpert.com/u/anonyo)\ **Post date:** [January 11, 2013, 5:28pm UTC](https://forums.yoyoexpert.com/t/i-think-yoyo-expert-should-sell-magic-yoyos/47385/28 "2013-01-11T17:28:48Z")
> [@Y0Y0SR2PR0](#): > > by adding magic yoyos to the site wouldn’t be a bad thing they make cheap metal throws that play like or near a 50-100 dollar throw and their designs are original(atleast of what i know) just my oppion might be wrong about originality but yoyos designs can have hints of each other > > -----edit----- > you can replace the concave bearing and not stock hubstacked throws also takes the infringement out just inform buyers. another one? ---
**Author:** ![Y0Y0SR2PR0](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex015/user_avatar/forums.yoyoexpert.com/y0y0sr2pr0/32/1137_2.png) [@Y0Y0SR2PR0](https://forums.yoyoexpert.com/u/Y0Y0SR2PR0)\ **Post date:** [January 11, 2013, 5:50pm UTC](https://forums.yoyoexpert.com/t/i-think-yoyo-expert-should-sell-magic-yoyos/47385/29 "2013-01-11T17:50:05Z")
didnt search if it existed til after it was posted ---
**Author:** ![jhb8426](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex015/user_avatar/forums.yoyoexpert.com/jhb8426/32/631_2.png) [@jhb8426](https://forums.yoyoexpert.com/u/jhb8426)\ **Post date:** [January 11, 2013, 7:47pm UTC](https://forums.yoyoexpert.com/t/i-think-yoyo-expert-should-sell-magic-yoyos/47385/30 "2013-01-11T19:47:06Z")
Didn’t take much of a “search”. It was about 5 topics down from yours. (merged) It might pay for you to read the whole topic so you have the background. ---
**Author:** ![Y0Y0SR2PR0](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex015/user_avatar/forums.yoyoexpert.com/y0y0sr2pr0/32/1137_2.png) [@Y0Y0SR2PR0](https://forums.yoyoexpert.com/u/Y0Y0SR2PR0)\ **Post date:** [January 11, 2013, 8:01pm UTC](https://forums.yoyoexpert.com/t/i-think-yoyo-expert-should-sell-magic-yoyos/47385/31 "2013-01-11T20:01:43Z")
didn’t see it … srry ---
**Author:** ![theTopo](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex015/user_avatar/forums.yoyoexpert.com/thetopo/32/1065_2.png) [@theTopo](https://forums.yoyoexpert.com/u/theTopo)\ **Post date:** [January 11, 2013, 9:09pm UTC](https://forums.yoyoexpert.com/t/i-think-yoyo-expert-should-sell-magic-yoyos/47385/32 "2013-01-11T21:09:19Z")
God-Tricks yoyos usually come with a concave bearing, but YYE sells them with a flat bearing to avoid infringing the Dif-E-Yo patent. They could easily sell Magic YoYos (MYY) like this. Just use flat bearings and avoid the few models with stacks. Problems they may have are quality control. I haven’t heard many reports of QC issues with Magic YoYos but normally at such a low price-point it’s difficult to maintain a very high level of QC. Also people may buy the cheap MYYs instead of more expensive brands which would result in less $$$ for YYE. > [@tschneider](#): > > Again, even though they’re based in China, what I really meant is that they’re not an actual company. They manufacture yoyos yes, but do they really design their own yoyos? Maybe, but they aren’t innovative or new, it’s just cheap and plays decently. I think that if YYE were to stock them, it would take away from other companies that actually put time and effort into design and manufacturing. How are are they not an “actual company”? I suggest you look up the definition of “company”. As for the designs, they are clearly paying someone to do it. They may be outsourcing the designs but I know of at least two large American company/manufacturer that have outsourced designs. I don’t see any problem with doing that. They even went to the effort of getting permission from Takuto to use an undercut on the N11. As for the lack of innovation, check out the finish on the N10. It’s more innovative than anything that has come from numerous other manufacturers. ---
**Author:** ![ratfacedudeguy](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex015/user_avatar/forums.yoyoexpert.com/ratfacedudeguy/32/273_2.png) [@ratfacedudeguy](https://forums.yoyoexpert.com/u/ratfacedudeguy)\ **Post date:** [January 11, 2013, 10:58pm UTC](https://forums.yoyoexpert.com/t/i-think-yoyo-expert-should-sell-magic-yoyos/47385/33 "2013-01-11T22:58:43Z")
What is all this business with Magic “not being an actual company?” I’ve never heard of such a thing before, and I think the only reason it was mentioned so many times in this thread was because it was convenient to latch onto because someone else said it. As far as the hubstack patent issue is concerned, the main focus of the patent seems to be the method in which the stacks are attached to the yoyo (the o-ring). [Have a ball](http://www.patentgenius.com/patent/7874890.html). ---
**Author:** ![supbreh1234](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex015/user_avatar/forums.yoyoexpert.com/supbreh1234/32/1131_2.png) [@supbreh1234](https://forums.yoyoexpert.com/u/supbreh1234)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2013, 6:05am UTC](https://forums.yoyoexpert.com/t/i-think-yoyo-expert-should-sell-magic-yoyos/47385/34 "2013-01-12T06:05:00Z")
You could always check out amazon, ebay, or yoyo(insert popular electronics store here). I understand yoyoexpert is awesome, but its not the only place to buy yoyos. Its andre coice to carry what brands he wants to. If he simply felt like not carrying yoyofactory per se, he could do that. ---
**Author:** ![augmentedloyalty](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex015/user_avatar/forums.yoyoexpert.com/augmentedloyalty/32/1218_2.png) [@augmentedloyalty](https://forums.yoyoexpert.com/u/augmentedloyalty)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2013, 8:22pm UTC](https://forums.yoyoexpert.com/t/i-think-yoyo-expert-should-sell-magic-yoyos/47385/35 "2013-01-15T20:22:43Z")
> [@DrAwesome](#): > > > [@Totalartist](#): > > > > > [@DrAwesome](#): > > > > > > > [@abby1371](#): > > > > > > > > And c3 Yoyo design so why not magic Yoyo? > > > > > > I’m pretty c3 is Japan. > > > > Yes. C3yoyodesign is in Hong Kong (China) as described on their official website in the “about us” section. > > yeah I wasn’t really sure > > And I think the reason is copy right. They are lacking the required things to have konkave bearings and hub stacks they could just replace the bearings with flat and the hubstack bearing size is b. ---
**Author:** ![jhb8426](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex015/user_avatar/forums.yoyoexpert.com/jhb8426/32/631_2.png) [@jhb8426](https://forums.yoyoexpert.com/u/jhb8426)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2013, 8:35pm UTC](https://forums.yoyoexpert.com/t/i-think-yoyo-expert-should-sell-magic-yoyos/47385/36 "2013-01-15T20:35:16Z")
> [@augmentedloyalty](#): > > they could just replace the bearings with flat and the hubstack bearing size is b. As I said earlier, I don’t have any basis for judging the company that makes Magic yoyos, but in general replacing parts is not an option as YYE does not do business with companies that produce bootleg yoyos as a matter of principle. Again I cannot say one way or the other if that company produces bootleg yoyos or not. ---
**Author:** ![yoyojohn](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex015/user_avatar/forums.yoyoexpert.com/yoyojohn/32/7911_2.png) [@yoyojohn](https://forums.yoyoexpert.com/u/yoyojohn)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2013, 11:59pm UTC](https://forums.yoyoexpert.com/t/i-think-yoyo-expert-should-sell-magic-yoyos/47385/37 "2013-01-15T23:59:10Z")
Why not buy them off ebay if you want them that bad? What’s so special about yye selling this brand rather than ebay? If Andre doesn’t want to sell them ,let him have his wishes. ---
**Author:** ![augmentedloyalty](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex015/user_avatar/forums.yoyoexpert.com/augmentedloyalty/32/1218_2.png) [@augmentedloyalty](https://forums.yoyoexpert.com/u/augmentedloyalty)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2013, 9:12pm UTC](https://forums.yoyoexpert.com/t/i-think-yoyo-expert-should-sell-magic-yoyos/47385/38 "2013-01-16T21:12:11Z")
> [@johnthejwolfe](#): > > Why not buy them off ebay if you want them that bad? What’s so special about yye selling this brand rather than ebay? If Andre doesn’t want to sell them ,let him have his wishes. sometimes or most is that it may take long as to say 3 weeks (since the new china law) it has to go through customs but if where yye shipped them it will result in faster shipping and magic yoyo can join the know brands. ---
**Author:** ![Nemyo](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex015/user_avatar/forums.yoyoexpert.com/nemyo/32/14407_2.png) [@Nemyo](https://forums.yoyoexpert.com/u/Nemyo)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2013, 10:12pm UTC](https://forums.yoyoexpert.com/t/i-think-yoyo-expert-should-sell-magic-yoyos/47385/39 "2013-01-18T22:12:02Z")
YYE doesnt want to support bootleg companies. End of story. ---
**Author:** ![theTopo](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex015/user_avatar/forums.yoyoexpert.com/thetopo/32/1065_2.png) [@theTopo](https://forums.yoyoexpert.com/u/theTopo)\ **Post date:** [January 19, 2013, 2:19am UTC](https://forums.yoyoexpert.com/t/i-think-yoyo-expert-should-sell-magic-yoyos/47385/40 "2013-01-19T02:19:03Z")
> [@Nemyo](#): > > YYE doesnt want to support bootleg companies. End of story. Please explain why Magic YoYo is a “bootleg company”. [Previous page](https://forums.yoyoexpert.com/t/i-think-yoyo-expert-should-sell-magic-yoyos/47385.md?page=1) [Next page](https://forums.yoyoexpert.com/t/i-think-yoyo-expert-should-sell-magic-yoyos/47385.md?page=3)